Emma Clarke pushes for perfection in every aspect of her life.
The Sydney Flames forward is one of the WNBL's best three-point shooters
and she's just getting started.
With a college basketball stint and a neuroscience degree under her belt,
her competitive drive is second to none.
But it was during her first go at three-on-three basketball
that she felt her and her competitive streak had finally met their match.
My name's Sophie and I'm the producer here at the Female Athlete Project.
At just 24, Emma Clarke has to be one of the most hard-working athletes
whose story I've heard.
She's full of grit and absolutely loves the grind.
And if I haven't convinced you,
just count how many times she says grind on this episode.
This chat is brought to you by Athena Sports Nutrition,
who are changing the sports nutrition game for women.
It's an honest reflection of what happens
when you combine perfectionism
with sport, so we hope you enjoy it.
Emma, welcome to the Female Athlete Project.
Yes, thank you so much for having me.
So happy to be here.
I'm very much looking forward to having a chat today.
And I've seen you've just signed a contract extension
with the Sydney Flames, which is massive.
So you're currently in Perth,
but you're going to be back over in Sydney once season starts.
How does it feel to sign on again with the Flames?
Yeah, really good.
I'm really excited for the two-year deal to be under Guy again.
at Hoops Capital, it's a really great club.
And yeah, I just feel like the professionalism
that they breed there is just, yeah, next level.
And I don't think I could find it like a better situation
anywhere else in the WNBL.
So yeah, I'm just ready to get there and get the ball rolling.
I played for the Flames back in my day, back in like,
I don't know, it was a long time ago, 2012, 2013,
I sat on the bench waving the towel around.
But it's pretty cool to see where the Flames are at now.
I played with Loz Nicholson.
She's an absolute legend.
But I think it's really cool to see where the Flames are at now.
But pretty cool, the talent, seeing Kayla George
and Tess Madgen from the Opals.
What's it been like to be a part of a group like that?
And like you said, there's three Opals there.
So just the culture that they bring and, you know,
they've had long seasons, long careers.
So yeah, they're really wise and, yeah, fun to be around.
They're really passionate.
Trainings are competitive.
And I feel like they just hold us to a higher standard
where you might not be able to get at other clubs where, you know,
there's maybe one Opal or, you know, not as many, you know,
experienced vets.
So, yeah, I love playing with all of them.
I like wise as a kind term to say that they're a bit older.
No, they've just played for so long, you know,
like Kayla's won a WNBA championship.
Like Loz has been, you know,
Defensive Player of the Year like recently and been to so many,
you know, overseas tournaments.
And obviously Tess is like the captain of the Opals.
So they've got a lot of wisdom under their belt.
Yeah, absolutely.
Can you take us back to the beginning and describe what you were like
Oh, it actually wasn't probably that long ago, to be honest.
No, I would definitely say I was like a curious, competitive,
confident, ambitious, like little kid.
You know, I feel like you couldn't really tell me to, you know,
stop doing what I was doing if it was, you know, a workout
or like playing a game or, you know, hanging out with friends.
Like I was just fully invested in like everything I did.
And yeah, I asked so many questions and I felt like I was just a little sponge,
you know, like soaking up everything I was a part of.
And yeah, I don't know.
I just, I just had a, had a love for competing and a love for sport.
Like I played tennis, I did ballet,
I did swimming and basketball, football, netball, like I did everything.
So yeah, definitely a little athletic kid that just liked to run around and
How was it that you picked basketball?
So my dad actually, like I played netball at school, but I was just,
I wasn't, I wasn't enjoying like the restricted areas that like you couldn't
like, you know, go on the whole court.
And he was like, oh, like, why don't you just try basketball?
And I was like, oh yeah, okay, try, give it a go.
I think I was nine when I played my first game.
And yeah, I just absolutely, yeah, fell in love with it.
Like you have to be able to do everything and you can run everywhere and,
you know, steal the ball and yeah, I don't know, just run the lanes.
And I read that you, because you were quite tall as a youngster,
you could probably get away with using your height to your advantage.
But when was it that you first realized that you might need to start developing
other aspects of your game?
When I was, I think I was under 14 or under 15.
It was like my first state kind of tournament that we traveled to the Southern
Or something it was called.
And yeah, like, like you said, I was, I talk about this in another article.
I was just so much taller in WA.
Like, not that we don't have the pool of athletes, but yeah,
I was just kind of pigeonholed to be, you know, in the middle of the keyway,
put my hands up kind of thing.
But then when we went to these tournaments, I like just was, you know,
having to shoot the ball from outside and couldn't get my shot off quickly.
And I remember coming back from that tournament and then my dad and I just
sat down, went back to the drawing board and we're like, all right,
let's just break down this shot completely.
What am I footwork, my hand technique, like, you know,
just everything broke it down, worked on it and tried a lot.
But I got, and yeah,
I just kind of stuck with those principles and those techniques since then.
I remember being like outside, just like at my ring on my back garden and
like just shooting free throws for hours and hours until I made like a specific
number in a row and had pegs that I'd like count how many I was going to get.
And I was like, oh, I'm going to get it.
I'm going to get it.
Like making a row out of 10 and yeah, be out there so late, hey.
Where was it that that drive and discipline came from, do you think?
I feel like just my, yeah, as a kid, like I just never like gave up on things.
Like I just, if something was challenging or hard, like I feel like I embraced it.
And, you know, the amount of times that I was like, this is so hard.
Like, what am I doing?
Like, oh my God, frustrated.
But I think it just, I just wanted to be better and I wanted to challenge me more.
So I think I've definitely as a younger kid, I was like that in all areas of my life,
like in school, like if I got a bad test result or something and, you know,
wanted to, you know, get an A grade or something, I would like study so much harder.
And yeah, I think it was just from a young age.
I got, yeah, really that instilled in me.
And then, yeah, it just carried on to basketball, which is good.
How have you learned to manage?
How have you learned to manage that balance?
Because I think for me, like when I stopped playing basketball, I realized how much pressure
I put on myself to always be perfect.
It is a sport in a way that demands perfection, like the size of the ball to the size of the
There's not a lot of room for error, right?
And as a kid or a young person who is really disciplined and motivated, but doesn't like
failure, how have you learned to manage that as you've grown up?
That's a really good question.
Cause I do strive.
The perfection I feel like, but the thing that I kind of just try to remind myself of
is that I feel like you actually can't be perfect at basketball because there's so many
areas that you need to be like good at to be successful.
Like you have to be able to shoot, like run the lanes, like, um, you know, play defense,
um, handle the ball.
Like there's just so many avenues that, you know, I feel like nobody can like perfect
basketball, right?
There's like, you know, you're swimming and whatever, and you're swimming for a time.
Or, you know, a certain technique and it's just, I'd feel very, I admire the swimmers
like so much, but I'm just, you know, basketball, there's just so many other avenues that you
have to be good at.
So I think I just try to remind myself like, okay, I'm just going to give this my best
effort and, you know, I'm just going to keep at it until I feel like I can, yeah, just
And I feel like that's what I like that every training session I can keep getting better.
And, um, yeah, every day, every week, every month, every season, you know, it's just,
it's an ongoing, um, yeah, goal to just be better.
You had the chance to go to the AIS or the Australian Center for, is it the Center for
Is that what it's called these days?
The Center of Excellence.
Do you remember when you got your call up and were invited to, to go?
I was, um, I was actually injured at the time.
Um, I had a stress fracture in my back.
And I genuinely thought it was a bad thing.
It was a joke, like, because I was injured and I hadn't played for, you know, quite a
And, um, Kristen Deal was the coach and she called me up to have the chat.
And I remember asking her, like, are you actually kidding me?
Like, I'm, I'm hurt.
Like, why do you want me?
And she's like, no, like, you're going to heal.
Like, you're going to get better and we want you here.
And, um, you know, we'll start year 12.
And so it just, yeah, I got on my recovery and then that was just the, yeah, the next
thing to look forward to.
Cause, um, that injury was really tough.
I'd say one of the biggest injuries.
Um, so yeah, to, to get that news then, um, I remember just sitting on my couch with my
mom and I was like, this isn't real.
Like how is this happening?
But, um, yeah, it was a really good time.
And what was that experience like for you being with some of the best athletes in the
Yeah, really good.
I mean, I was at the beginning, I think I was the only one from WA.
So, um, yeah, first time obviously living away from home, but yeah, to be able to compete
against those girls, like every day was.
Just, um, it was so good.
I feel like if you're in a good team and a good environment and, you know, with other
challenging, you know, players and, um, competitive people, like it just lifts and elevates you.
So, um, yeah, it took a lot away from my stint at the AIS for sure.
You made the decision to go over to the U S and play college basketball.
Was that a tough decision to make?
Um, I'd say yes and no.
Cause I feel like I always wanted to go to college.
Um, I wanted to just, yeah, see how it was going to go.
Cause I just knew that, you know, if I went and I didn't like it or, you know, I went
and I wasn't like a big fan, I could always come back and, um, then try to compete for
But, um, you know, I feel like the WNBL wasn't going anywhere.
Well, I would say not going anywhere, but it was always going to be a pro league back
So, you know, you have a kind of a shorter stint or a shorter opportunity with college.
Um, so I was just like, yeah, I want to go and try it.
And then, yeah, if it doesn't work out, I'll come back.
So yeah, it was tough.
I had a few obstacles.
And, you know, signing and all that kind of thing.
And, um, but once it was done, yeah, got there and had a good time.
How do you feel like your game changed while you're over in the college system?
Um, I'd say the biggest thing, and I say this to everybody, I definitely think I was in
the best shape of my life.
Um, I was at Colorado, so we were obviously at altitude.
So that was just, you know, 5,000 feet.
So that was, yeah, that was just in itself, like a big, um,
a big difference.
So, you know, we'd go down to sea level and we'd be able to like run continuous.
Like I was, yeah, it was crazy, but, um, there was that, but then the, just the training
that we did there, I think like so many other people would agree with me.
It's like you're training every day and then you go on a school and then class and then
study break or study hall.
And then, you know, you'll go and, you know, lift and then you're on court for three hours
and then you'll go do like, I don't know, like a sled workout or like you'll run stairs.
Um, but yeah, I just remember the workouts and, you know, what it took to, you know,
the energy you had to put into the workouts was just something that I really took away
was, you know, the hard work that it takes to get to those levels.
So, um, yeah, I'd say the, yeah, that was my biggest takeaway.
When you're in those, like in the hurt locker, in the dark places, just grinding away, what
is it like, is there an end goal for you?
Is there something that you were striving towards this dream that you'd had since being
Or is it just getting through and pushing yourself to that limit?
Um, my goal, sorry, as a little kid would definitely have been like getting to the Olympics.
I think like representing Australia on that national stage and, you know, at such a prestigious
games, um, it's always been a goal of mine.
Um, so yeah, definitely in those like tough times or, you know, workouts, like, you know,
really tough and you're in, like you said, like a dark place and, you know, you just
Um, I wouldn't say I think of those things like immediate look like, you know, on the
spot, but I'd say that, you know, it's just got to get through the workout, like, you
know, keep pushing myself.
Um, you know, it's just, it's comforting to feel how, you know, how much I can push myself.
I feel like sometimes I surprise myself with like, damn, I really like pushed through and
got through that workout.
Like go me like that was great.
So I think like those continuous little building blocks, you know, I'm like, damn, like that
was a really hard workout, but Hey, we're here.
We're still alive.
When was your first exposure to three on three basketball?
Um, so after my first year with Sydney, so it would've been my third season, the WNBL,
um, I got invited to a camp, um, in Melbourne, um, Damon Lowry called me up and, you know,
said, we want you at the camp.
And I was like, Oh yeah.
I've never played before.
Like, you want me at the camp?
Like I'm a bit confused.
We want you there.
Like, you know, we want, here's the camp, the dates, whatever will come.
And, you know, and that was, that was tough.
That was a really hard camp.
And I just, I love three X three.
Like I fell in love with it straight away, just the style of play and the competitiveness
and, you know, the grit that it takes to like be successful.
Um, I feel like because I'm such a, you know, I just love working.
And I just like, love the grind that it was just, it matched me completely.
So, um, yeah, that camp was just really fun.
And then a few months later, I got the call to go to, um, a women's series tournament
in Wuhan, um, which was really cool.
That was my first, um, like overseas, like national international experience with three
X three and yeah, couldn't get enough of it.
What did it mean to you to wear the Australian Jersey?
I mean, I don't think there's a better feeling like to represent your country.
Um, I had represented Australia and like junior tournaments and stuff, um, you know, with,
you know, under 16s, under 17s and that, but I feel like in an open level and like
at a, um, you know, a national like sport, like that's just highly recognized.
It's just, um, it's so special.
Like I can't even really describe it.
Like you just work so hard to get to that point.
And then, yeah, the moment.
That you're like, you got the Jersey and you're putting it on.
It's just like, it's the whole, it's the whole thing.
Like it just brings back, like, you know, all the training you put in all the work,
all the things you sacrifice and, you know, the early mornings, late nights and, you know,
meal planning, you know, psych appointments, like everything.
It just kind of like hit me at once.
I was like, damn, like I got to this point, like with all those things and it was just,
yeah, such a, such a nice feeling.
And it's now an Olympic sport three X three, and we saw the pretty special moment where
the Aussie team qualified for Paris.
You didn't get to be a part of that moment, but what was it like watching on?
I mean, those girls just play so well and so hard together at, um, just the ability
to obviously train and play with them at the camps and Marina and Annalia are in Perth at
So, um, yeah, seeing them on like, you know, day to day basis is really cool.
And then, yeah, it's just knowing a little bit of the background as well about like what
they're talking about in huddles or like, you know, what Damon might be communicating to
them after the games.
Just, um, yeah, it's just so special.
Like the passion that they show is, yeah, it's honestly unmatched and yeah, no better,
no better feeling.
And so excited for the girls for the Olympic stint.
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Can you break down 3x3 compared to normal five-a-side basketball for people who might
not know the difference between the two?
Yeah, so I'd say 3x3, there's four on the team.
Um, you play in the half court, um, they call it like street ball.
I'd say it's so much more than that, but it's just, yeah, three versus three.
You check the ball.
Um, after you score, you got a, the other, the defense has to check it outside the three point line.
Um, the games go for 10 minutes, the referees don't call fouls, so it's really tough.
Points are scored like a three pointer in five on five is worth two.
Um, in, um, 3x3 and then a two pointer is worth one point.
So yeah, it's either the winner is either first to 21 or whoever has the most points
at the end of 10 minutes.
Um, it is such a hard game, but I love it.
And where's your head at?
Do you have goals to return into that team?
Yeah, no, definitely.
I'd say I've had just such a small taste of it.
I, um, yeah, like I said, I feel like 3x3 is, I feel like it's the core of me.
Like I just match so well with like what's needed to be successful at the sport, like
in terms of the, the grit that you need and like the inner dog.
Um, but yeah, I, I can't wait to hopefully be a part of the, um, boards and teams to
come in the future.
You touched on your back injury earlier on in your career and you recently had a stress
fracture in your tibia.
Can you talk us through that one?
Um, so the fracture that I had most recently.
Um, in this last WNBL season, in the preseason, I had like a calf strain.
Um, and yeah, I was, it was treated a calf strain, had a, um, ultrasound and had a few
weeks off and was managing it.
Um, but then, yeah, once I returned, like it, it was really like the pain was kind of
Like it was really good for a few weeks and I was like, Oh, I was a bit sore.
And like, yeah, cause I work out so much on off days and try to get in lots of extras
Um, I was like, is it cause I'm doing more workouts?
Or, you know, like, am I not like not recovering properly or whatever, but it was never sore
enough to like actually pull me out of training.
Um, and it was just a niggle and what I thought was a calf strain.
So I just, yeah, kept training, kept doing my calf raises and, um, yeah, it wasn't until
I got home in March where I'm a part of the WAIS program here.
So, um, I was getting my screening and I was like, you know, I've had this calf strain
since like, you know.
So I was like, okay, I'm going to do this, you know, October last year, like we get this
sorted out, like we get an MRI or, you know, what should I be doing more calf raises or
And then, um, the physios, I'll get in touch with the doctor and we'll just send you for
Um, and then, yeah, the results come back and this was the day before I was meant to
go to Singapore with the 3x3 team for a camp.
Um, and the doctor was like, um, Emma, there's nothing wrong with your calf, like the strains
healed, but you have a grade three stress fracture.
You have to be up.
And I was just like, oh my God, you're kidding me.
You're in a moon boot like six weeks and yeah, it's last Thursday was, it was been three
months since I found that out.
So yeah, we're getting there though.
It's definitely an obstacle that I've been, um, yeah, managing, but it's kind of funny
to reflect on like my whole WNBL season.
Like the doctor said, like you've had this injury for like months and you've just been
playing through it and the amount of pain that you're in, you just don't know because,
you know, it's just.
It's just been day after day, just getting a little bit worse.
So, um, yeah, it was kind of funny reflecting on the season, like, damn, I had like a really
serious injury that whole time.
And, um, yeah, I had no idea.
So yeah, it's, it's impressive.
I don't want to reinforce the message of playing through injuries, but it's impressive that
you were able to get through that and still perform.
And I think that's something that like the Sydney medical staff, like just couldn't get
their head around.
Cause it just didn't present.
There's a stress fracture and I just wasn't in the pain that, you know, other people would
like typically be in or what would be the case for a stress fracture.
So, um, I definitely feel for the medical staff, but, um, yeah, it's, it's kind of crazy.
I'd say, yeah, I just, I couldn't stop though.
Cause I just, I didn't feel like I was in pain.
So it was, I don't want to say it was my doing, but, um, yeah, listen to your body guys.
How did it, how did you process the emotion being told by the doctor?
The day before you were due to fly out that you actually were going to have to be in a
boot and you're ruled out.
Um, I think it's because nothing actually like happens, like, you know, other injuries
I had in the past, you know, like, oh, you roll your ankle or, you know, you break your
hand or a finger or whatever.
Like there's a moment in time that it happens, but I feel like, you know, I'd, I'd been like
the day before that I found this, this information out, like I'd trained twice I'd lifted, like
I was training, I was preparing and then it's like, oh no, you actually have an injury.
And I was like, wait a second, like, I don't like I'm not, I'm fine.
Um, so yeah, it was, I think coming to terms with the fact that I was actually injured,
even though I felt like I was still able to perform at like my best, um, was really hard.
And then, yeah, obviously the timing before going to Singapore, I was like, God got to
But then on the other note, I was like, well, thank goodness I didn't go because the doctor
had said, you know, if you had a gone and played three X three on like that plastic,
it caught and, you know, done double days and, you know, long, hard sessions, like he
said, you would have probably broken your leg.
I was like, well, I didn't go, so yeah, looking at it from two lenses, but I think, yeah,
once I kind of accepted the injury, I was like really actually grateful that they were
able to pick it up.
Yeah, absolutely.
I've been asking athletes lately, the question of what is your favorite failure?
I, after my second season with the legs, um, like I was a contracted player, but I,
like we'd made, we'd made the, um, the finals and the semifinals, we had a really good team
Um, but yeah, being in the 10, um, you know, you assume, I don't say assume, but like you
just kind of think that you're going to travel to like the, you know, the semifinals and
all that kind of stuff.
And, um, I'm very grateful for it now, but I actually didn't get like picked.
Um, to go to like the semifinal or the grand final series, um, when I was a contracted
player with the links, um, it was really tough because I was like, what do you mean?
Like what really hard for this?
I feel like I've, you know, um, put so much energy and effort and I was like an upcoming
And, um, even though like I wasn't deep into the rotation, um, that did really hurt me.
Um, but I'd say in the other note, like it really motivated me to then, you know, work,
keep working harder and, um, kind of prove why I needed to be, you know, a rostered position
and like valued rostered player.
So then, yeah, the decision to go to Sydney was, um, I don't want to say easy for me,
but it was just like, I want to go and find myself in a new environment and kind of have
a reset and just, yeah, get back to business and work hard and yeah.
On that grind, who is the person who's had the biggest influence on you?
Um, this was tough to think about actually, like I've been asked this question quite a
Um, cause I would say there's so many people that have impacted me, like all of my family
and coaches and teammates and, um, everything, but I would say the biggest one would be my
Um, I know most people probably say their mom, but for me, like she sacrificed just
so much when I was younger and growing up as a single mom.
And working multiple jobs when I wasn't with her during, um, my dad's week, um, you know,
she just provided and sacrificed and, you know, I think she's just the epitome of like
hard work and no matter what she had going on, she was always such a vibrant, um, you
know, personality and made me feel loved and cared about and, you know, still held me to
a high standard and was always there when I needed her.
So, um, yeah, I would say she's definitely had the biggest impact and just, you know,
I feel like teaching me to just have fun, like in the moment and enjoy what I'm doing.
Um, cause I feel like, you know, you can really get caught up in the, you know, every external
factor or, you know, like putting pressure on yourself, but like, you know, just go out
there and have a good time and, um, yeah, try your best.
So, um, yeah, shout out to my mom.
You've talked a lot about how hard you work on the court and how you love the grind.
How do you look after yourself away from the court?
I'd say definitely having like multiple avenues, like for outlets, you know, you can get really
caught up in, you know, watching basketball, playing basketball, coaching people at basketball.
So, you know, to be able to have, whether that's like work or uni or, you know, every
like, you know, once or twice a week, like you go for coffee with a friend, um, I'd say
those things are really important.
Um, but then also I do like see a sports psych, um, who's really good with helping me with,
you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the, you know, the,
you know, the, you know, the level of perfection that I try to reach and all those kinds of
Um, yeah, she's awesome.
Um, but then also come on quite a, I would say, I wouldn't say strict meal plan, but
I try to eat really well, um, to give myself the best foundation for my recovery, especially
after this injury.
Um, and then also like being sponsored by like the Athena, um, company is just, it's
The products have all the things that I feel like I require.
For like to be excelling at my sport.
So, you know, I recover with, you know, in the protein, but it's got like plus iron or
like I have my, um, my protein bar, you know, plus calcium preteen plus electrolytes.
Like it's all the things like it's so convenient.
And I feel like with my meal planning, you know, you can just grab a meal and go, it's
the same with Athena.
Like I can just make a protein shake and without having to add in all these other things, it's
I can just make a protein shake and my electrolytes and my calcium, you know, everything's in
So, um, yeah, just trying to stay on top of eating well and putting the right things in
my body to heal myself properly and yeah, give my best self the advantage on court.
What does that look like having a strict meal plan?
Is that something that's hard to stick to?
Um, it is, I feel like, um, I, I really enjoy it though, because I feel like I'm really
I can eat the same thing.
Like every day, like I don't have a problem with that.
Um, I'd say it's just the first few weeks was pretty tough.
Um, but yeah, it's, yeah, it's definitely challenging, but I do actually quite enjoy
Um, just the, you know, making all the food on like a Sunday and then just having it all
prepared for the week and, you know, just being able to grab my container and run or,
you know, grab my little jar of oats in the morning.
It's just so convenient.
But, um, yeah, I feel like once you get there and you're like, I don't know how many days.
I said that days they say it takes to build a habit, but yeah, it was definitely tough
at the start, but I'm happy that where I've got to now, it's pretty good though.
For someone who does sound very, very disciplined, what's the difference between discipline and
motivation for you?
Oh, um, I would say discipline, like you're adhering to like routines and actions, even
when you don't feel like motivated to like do them.
I would definitely say there's like an element of commitment that requires you to like establish
your long-term goals.
Um, but yeah, discipline, like being focused and staying on track, you know, each and every
day, like, you know, you don't want to get out of bed or you don't want to, you know,
do an extra rep in the gym or whatever.
Like even when motivation's not there, being able to like stay on track, regardless, um,
of like how you feel in the moment.
Um, but then yeah, motivation, I'd say like, there's obviously internal.
And external drivers that, um, you know, can motivate you and they can fluctuate a lot,
you know, based on feeling, or, you know, obviously can't control your external environment,
but, um, I'd say it's a good, like Kickstarter or like a good energy first, um, yeah, to
like do something, but then yeah, discipline is definitely where it, uh, where that level
of commitment and I'd say grind, like really shows.
Uh, thank you so much for your time today.
Emma, having a chat to us, it's been really cool to hear about just how disciplined you
Like it just kind of the excitement and stuff, it kind of like oozes out of you.
You can see how much you love it while you're talking about it, which is really cool.
Uh, looking forward to watching you this season again with the flames and can't wait to hopefully
see you back in that three X three environment as well.
Thank you so much.
I've loved chatting.
Thanks so much for listening.
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