How Ilona Maher Went From Awkward Kid To The Most Followed Rugby Player In The World

She's an athlete that needs no introduction, but we're going to give you one anyway.

Growing up, Alona Marr was a self-described awkward kid, but sport was always the place

where she felt she belonged.

After trying every sport under the sun, from softball to basketball, she finally found

rugby when she was in her senior year of high school and never looked back.

The Rugby Sevens Olympic medalist takes us through her journey to becoming an American

Eagle and how she worked from the ground up to complement her rugby career with an

epic social media platform.

A platform she uses to encourage women around the world to take up sport, be confident and

own how hard they've worked.

My name's Sophie Norris and I'm the producer here at the Female Athlete Project.

This week, Chloe sat down with a very special guest, Alona Marr.

The most followed rugby player on Instagram gets vulnerable with Chloe about her childhood,

her confidence growing up and when she knew it was

time to shoot her Olympic shot.

Thanks to our friends at Budgie Smuggler, towards the end of the pod, you can also hear Alona

rank her favourite Aussie foods and give some hot takes on other iconic snacks.

We hope you enjoy this episode.

All right, let's go.

Alona Marr, welcome to the Female Athlete Project.

Thank you for having me.

This was such a late notice.

I messaged you, I think, on Monday.

I was like, hey, do you still want to do that podcast?

And you flew down here.

You made it work.

Yeah, we made it work.

I mean, I think you were worth the time, but we made it work.

I appreciate it.

Thank you.

We always start our podcast, we go back to childhood.

Can you describe Alona as a little kid?

She was, you know, a very strong kid physically.

She was always a bigger kid than the other kids and never understood why she was bigger.

And she loved sports.

I think sports was a place where she could really express herself because she was so

good at them.

Like, you know, you put her on a softball diamond and she was wham and pitches in there.

I think she was unsure of herself at a lot of times, but through like activity and stuff

like that, she she found a place, had trouble making friends, was definitely a little socially

awkward, came from a small Catholic school.

OK, so I didn't know how to actually talk to people, which a lot of people don't think.

But if you talk to my family, it's completely different.

I mean, I was very didn't know how to do it.

And in high school was still trying to find my place.

So I think I blossomed late college.

But.

Definitely not a sheltered life, but I had a you know, I had everything I needed.

My parents worked very hard for my sisters and I and we.

Forever grateful because they've you know, I think everything they've done has led me

to this.

Was that religious school upbringing?

I don't know if that was part of your family as well.

Like I found for me.

So I grew up in a Christian family and that intersection between my sheltered Christian

family life and the sport was kind of a weird thing because there was like you're very

sheltered in one.

But then the sport element socially opens up a lot of doors.

Yes.

So I went to like Catholic school in my class.

I graduated in class of nine people.

And then after that, the school shut down because they just didn't have enough people.

But I would go play sports at the local middle school.

Yeah.

And I would my one of my classmates and I, we would walk to middle school and middle

schoolers are scary.

They're scary kids.

Even as an adult.

Even as they walk past me on the street, I'm like, don't look it up.

Don't look it up.

So we would walk to we would play field hockey and softball at the local middle school.

And that was kind of like my where I would get out of that sheltered life.

It was in my class was I think six girls, three boys, and they were my brothers and

sisters.

So then when I go to this middle school, the girls are wearing their layer tank tops, you

know, and they had their cool Abercrombie stuff on and I've been wearing my uniform

all day.

So it was definitely that exposure.

I think it was good.

It wasn't fun.

It was very hard.

I was the thing that helped me was I was so good.

I was so good at the sports I was doing.

So then you find your place there.

But it was very hard.

My mom just told me, you know, just just go and find a group of girls and just stand there

and then you're part of the group.

So I would just go stand there like a weirdo.

And a lot of my I now know some of them would say, like, yeah, we thought you were weird.

True.

But that was kind of my intersection of like learning.

And then high school learned a little more.

But I am constantly kind of figuring out.

I think sometimes I am still that little awkward girl.

And I kind of now owned it, the awkwardness.

But it has me throughout.

Yeah.

What did you love about sport?

Like, obviously, you were good at it.

But what did you love about it?

I think that and I talk about a lot, but always feeling very big and not understanding, like,

why do I look this way?

And yet I'm so good and I'm faster than those girls.

I'm fitter than the skinnier girls.

I just never understood it.

And so sport, I think, gave me a place where, like,

I felt like I belonged, like, and I probably say, actually, but when you're good at a sport in America, that's that's top notch.

God, yeah.

We love athletes.

You know, that's like, yeah, you could be the smartest kid in school, but we care about the quarterback.

So for me, it was like that was kind of how I earned my respect was through sport.

And it gave me something to understand what my body's capable of.

I think I now I realize it probably back then.

I didn't realize it.

But I always just encouraged anything to get into any sport.

I.

I push rugby, but it can be any because I think it's really helped me to to see what this is capable of when I never felt like I really.

Was the standard of maybe beauty or size.

And when when did rugby come into the picture?

That wasn't until senior year of high school, which is I don't know what yours would that be?

Year 12.

Year 12.

Year 12.

I'd always been a very high level athlete.

My dad is actually a rugby player.

He's played for like 40 years now and he loves it.

But.

Is he still playing?

Not anymore.

I think his last game was probably like three years ago.

And that was like, all right.

Or maybe even more.

He they play for a long time.

Those old boys, they keep going.

But he never encouraged us to play because there was never high level rugby around.

So why would I put my daughter in, you know, some rugby when she could go be playing varsity basketball and having funding through basketball and softball?

And she can go to softball pitching clinics and do travel basketball.

So he loves rugby.

He would have wanted to get it.

But he also wanted the best for us.

So I never tried it out until senior year when I just kind of decided softball wasn't for me, which I'd known it wasn't for me.

Whenever I was with my sister, whenever Olivia would be pitching, I'd be in the outfield.

And I probably had a terrible attitude the whole time because I just didn't like I wasn't really the biggest fan of the sport.

But I just said, Dad, I don't want to play softball.

He's like, oh, yeah, we have to do something.

And so I said, well, there's the local rugby club.

I could go try that out.

And I got there.

Like, I think practice started at 3.30 p.m. or something.

And I.

And I get there, you know, as a varsity athlete, boots on 3.15.

I'm ready to go.

I'm sitting on this bench like, what is going on?

Nobody's here yet.

So I call my dad up.

Dad, there's there's I don't think practice is today.

There's nobody here.

He said, just just wait.

And then as it gets closer to the time, like 3.30, like 3.25, 3.30, people start rolling in.

And I'm like, OK, this is club rugby.

This isn't what I've been playing.

But it was so fun because it was a different people were there for to have fun.

And I was almost the first time I was making actual friends, just like being myself.

And I loved it and then made the late decision to go play in college.

I was going to go to kind of the local university and try to play field hockey there.

But it was so close to home, like a mile away from home, and I didn't want to.

So I was made such a kind of a statement in my first few games of rugby and was picked up to play in a college in Vermont and then transferred and just kind of kept playing.

And so before you transferred, is it right that the coach of that college saw you playing was like, I want you to come.

I'm with the transfer call.

Yeah.

So it's all very harsh in America.

Like coaches can't do that because of NCAA rules.

Yeah.

So she noticed me because in my I swear pink scrum cap and we played them.

And this is I played for Norwich University and I transferred to Quinnipiac University.

And when we played Quinnipiac, I scored like three tries.

I mean, I was balling out in college ball.

I mean, I was really something I was like to behold.

Not anymore, but it's like the holding college ball.

So I was really doing well.

And I just I want.

I wanted to transfer.

I was not happy with my situation.

So I sent her a message, you know, hey, my name's Alana Mar.

I was that girl in the pink scrum cap.

I scored three tries on you.

Is there an opportunity to transfer?

And there's a lot of rules that go on, like she can't talk to you or something.

So we kind of figured that all out.

And I went and visited it and I realized it was kind of the environment I wanted to be in.

Definitely didn't want to be.

I never pictured myself being a transfer student.

I wanted to.

I was so excited for college because I thought it was like this is a fresh start.

I can be who I want to be here.

I can make new friends.

And freshman year was definitely tough.

And then transferring sophomore year, I was a transfer.

It wasn't like the fresh newness of being a freshman, but it was still a great move for me.

And we did so well there and kind of kept growing in rugby.

And we didn't play much sevens for Quinnipiac.

It was mostly 15s.

But I did whatever I could to be noticed by the USA coaches.

Yeah.

Got you.

Can you give us a bit of insight?

We were predominantly Australian.

A bit of insight into the American college experience.

We've obviously got amazing athletes from Australia who head over and basketball is like a pretty big one.

What was that experience like for you?

It definitely was not the classic college experience, but I think there's room to have that for sure.

I did nursing as a major as well, which is a very time consuming major.

I, from my junior to senior year, I had to do 12 hour clinicals like two times a week.

So I'd be going to hospitals through all over Connecticut and I'd have to miss practice or miss this.

So it was definitely not the normal experience, but it's fun.

I mean, we love sports.

We're a sporting nation and college athletics.

When you're on a sports team in college, it's like your personality.

It's kind of like who you are.

You know, I'm on the rugby team.

Like, you know me, you know, the rugby team has a party here.

You're friends with this people.

Like being an athlete, I think is kind of a place of pride and defines a lot of us.

And I loved it.

I loved that blending of having my friends on the rugby team and then also like going out with them.

But meeting the other people, it's cool.

You go into college automatically with a friend group and then hopefully get to meet others.

But it is also a lot like you're being college athletes, not for the week.

You're up at 630 a.m.

We did a whole dry season as well.

I was like a rugby team doing a dry season.

I know.

I know.

So we did a whole dry season.

And so it wasn't the classic one, but I wanted to have that classic college experience.

And I had moments of it, snippets of it.

But I also didn't have as many friends in college as I would have hoped for.

It wasn't until I think later when I got into USA, when I really started to, I think, figure myself out more and the person I am and the friends I want to have.

Yeah.

I was going to ask you, like, from that awkward kid when you were at that college age,

had you changed much or not until you got into that USA program?

High school.

I think there have been moments where I've been kind of not beaten down physically, but beaten down in how I view myself and thinking, you know, I'm friends with people and actually not being that way or whatnot.

So that's always been something that's I've always had trouble with that, making friends or believing people like me in a way.

High school, I think I was still that kind of quiet kid.

College started to figure out a little bit more.

I don't think.

I don't think it was until my senior year when I started to play, like, club rugby.

So in the summer, I played club rugby for a team in New York.

And I guess I think getting to experience maybe people who are living their life.

It's not just college students.

I really kind of found myself there.

And but I do think it was getting out, going to USA and that boosted my confidence.

Also being around that group of women, I think it's always really helped me.

So you're born out in college.

You're trying to impress the American coach, the USA.

Coach, when was like that first interaction or the first moment you're like, OK, I might be on here?

Well, you know, I never thought about doing it.

I don't think many females are like men.

Many women are like, yep, I'm going to be a pro athlete.

This is a realistic dream.

I'm going to make so much money.

Maybe now it is.

But when I was growing up doing you feel like you basketball, it wasn't really it wasn't realistic.

We weren't planning on I'm going to sign a million dollar contract.

This will be great.

Let me just focus on sport.

So I never thought to make.

This is my thing.

That's why I did nursing was nursing was I'm going to be a nurse and then play rugby.

I when I transferred it, my thing was.

I don't actually have to play rugby, but I do want to go to a good nursing school.

Thankfully, Quinnipiac had great rugby and great nursing.

So the two just kind of married together.

I don't think it was until like maybe during my junior year of college where it kind of tickled my mind.

Like people kept saying, oh, you could be an eagle.

You know, you could be an eagle one day.

And I was like, right.

I don't understand what that means.

And so it wasn't so junior year kind of thought about it.

But it's a it's a kind of scary dream to have.

Right.

To go to the Olympics to kind of take what you've been worked so hard for with nursing and with this something that's so that you'll have a job for the rest of your life with nursing and whatever your degree is.

So to kind of put that to the side and go on this so that I decided to play the club rugby.

And that was kind of my first of trying to get into the eye of the coach for USA.

And then senior year, I went to a couple of tournaments with the team in.

Like Barbados and Vegas.

And I balled out there as well.

Really great.

A great time playing club.

I was killing it back.

Yeah.

Great places to go.

And I really, you know, knew that those were my moments where I wanted to be seen.

And so in Vegas, I played really well and got the call to come out to the center.

And I mean, I remember going to these nursing professors like, you know, do you think I should do this?

What do you think?

It was also a chance.

It was kind of the thing back in the day where they'd say, yeah, we're interested in you.

You wouldn't hear from them.

They said.

They want me to come out to a camp in May.

And then I didn't get my flight plans until like, I think, three days before.

Whoa.

But I was like ready to go.

And so I was talking to my nurse professors and they said, you know, they'll always be sick people.

But the Olympics kind of won and, you know, very small chance.

So I decided to have my boards out in California.

I planned for it all and kind of did the leap to go play.

And I think it was on for like a three month thing.

Wasn't getting paid.

Was living in team housing.

But I got selected for the first tour.

And then.

I think a month later got selected for the World Cup.

And that was kind of the start of it.

And how was that experience for you?

I don't think I should have been there.

A thousand percent.

Which should not have been on that team.

I had no idea what was happening.

I'd only been at camp for like two weeks.

That's how it used to be, though.

Oh, totally.

You know, totally.

They were just like new players.

You've got potential.

You showed out.

Have a go.

Put them on there.

Have a go.

100%.

Against the rest of the world.

See what happens.

Hey, you don't know our defensive system.

That's fine.

So I don't know if I should have been there, but I'm so grateful I was there to start me off.

I wasn't sure what was happening.

I think I did two minutes about each game, but I scored a pretty good try against Spain.

My first ever try.

And I cut in and I felt really good.

I was pretty cool afterwards.

I look cool.

I remember I saw the clip recently.

Did you do a try celebration?

No, no.

I'm always chill with it.

I was like, that's what I do.

And so.

I do remember that, but I don't think I should have been out there, but I'm so happy.

And then for the World Cup as well.

I don't know if I should have made that team as well, but I was just with rugby.

You can also have in special sevens.

You just have some stellar athletes.

I was a stellar athlete and I also knew the game.

I didn't know the sevens game as well, but I also knew it because I a lot of people coming

into rugby in the US had never really played, whereas I'd played for four years in college.

So, yes, I hadn't played.

I hadn't played sevens, but I knew rugby.

So being selected for that World Cup team was so cool.

I scored a big try against Russia to put us through to like the semifinals.

And then I found my place.

I think we got a new coach.

And in September, I felt like I knew it and I was part of it more like I deserve to be

here and played really well, I think, in Glendale.

And then that was kind of the start of the journey.

Yeah.

OK.

Yeah.

Wow.

I remember that period of time, I feel like, because.

Looking at the Aussie team, we were a lot of like touch footballers, right?

And there was like chat, even during Rio, there was chat from the New Zealand coach

and he like, there was this article, our coach stuck this article up in our change room ahead

of the gold medal match in Rio.

And the New Zealand coach said that we didn't like contact.

We shied away from the breakdown and we were like small and didn't like it.

But I felt like that period of time, USA, New Zealand in particular, were working out that

that contact area of the game was huge.

Like, sevens had almost been like quite expansive, quick, but then I feel like you guys almost

worked out the power part of it was a huge part of the game.

Like, I feel like players like Tapa and you coming in kind of shifted that.

I think we're, since I've been on the team, we've been trying to find our identity.

And I think the identity we've had is physical.

Yeah.

Being that we're, I mean, we're big women, we're strong women.

One thing about us is we're athletes.

We want to be known as rugby players, but we're also athletes.

And that's what we're going to be.

I mean, we're not, we don't have the mindset of like, I wish I'd played touch because I

watch it, how they can go around and create space.

We're just not, we're going to create space by trying to, you know, suck you all in and

then see what we've created from there.

So it's always interesting to see how it's evolved and how our system has kind of changed

and playing these other teams.

Because I love watching, I mean, I love the way that Australia even plays because it's

so different than us.

The way they're willing to throw those passes and go around and create so much more.

I think it's...

Maybe more creative than us in some ways.

We're trying to get there, but I think it's very creative what they do.

Yeah.

Let's take a look at Tokyo, the postponed Olympics.

Yeah.

What was it like for you getting to pull on your national colours and represent your

country at the Olympics?

It was, I mean, what everybody wanted.

I think that I was fine with there not being fans there because all I want, I wanted to

win a medal, but we all want to also have that title Olympic, Olympia next to us.

And so that was so amazing.

So even though it wasn't the Olympics that we all had hoped for, I was so excited for

it.

I do remember when it was postponed, how sad I was.

I was like, I got to do another year of conditioning, another year of this.

Like, it's not...

It was a daunting task.

It's not fun.

Not fun.

That training is not fun.

Not fun.

And people are lying to you if they say it's fun.

No, like, I love the grind.

I love it sometimes.

Not all the time.

And Tokyo was good.

But we lost in the quarterfinals there, which is...

I don't know.

I don't know.

Australia did as well.

It was just a weird tournament.

You know, it was a weird time.

We hadn't played each other.

You know, usually we play each other all the time, constantly on the series.

We hadn't played these teams in so long.

And then we...

Before Tokyo, we'd played GB like six different times in LA for a warm-up tournament.

And we'd beat them every time.

But every time, the margin of error, the margin of win got smaller and smaller.

Okay.

And then the last game, we tied them, which it was kind of an interesting take from our

sports psych, was like, I should have capitalized on that.

I should have said something about that.

Because then we played them in the quarterfinals, and they were like, well, we got better and

better in that pre-tournament.

Kind of...

USA kind of got...

Went downhill a little bit.

But since we won everything, it was like, oh, well, we're set to go.

I thought that was a really interesting take.

And then they beat us in the quarterfinals.

And it was hard.

I really suffered with, like, post-Olympic blues and depression after that.

I don't know if you felt any of that as well.

Even from winning gold, people can feel that.

And it was a tough go for me.

I felt like it was, at times, my fault.

But that's sevens.

You know, it's an interesting game.

It's a fickle game in that it's never one mistake that'll lose a game.

But it is one mistake that will lose a game.

It just turns so fast, doesn't it?

Yeah.

Do you think that's spoken about enough, like that?

And it doesn't necessarily have to be Olympics, but that post-Olympics blues and depression

that people can go through after, like...

It might be a pinnacle in terms of the event.

But the result might go either way.

And people kind of have that come down after that.

I don't...

I think it's being talked about more, especially, like, with Michael Phelps' Weight of Gold documentary.

I think I was just really aware that that's what I was in.

Because I'd watched the documentary beforehand and I'd been talked to.

I knew that that's what I had because...

And I...

Even some of my teammates now were feeling it.

I didn't feel it so much after this Olympics.

I think because I felt very fulfilled and I was on a dance with the stars, so I was busy.

I had my mind going.

But I had some of my teammates who...

We'd won the medal and now they were just kind of back to training.

And the whole team was different.

The whole culture was different.

The girls you'd been grinding with for three years are gone.

And I think a lot of my teammates struggled, who I, you know, chatted with.

Because it's hard.

You go from this event every four years.

That's what everybody thinks of.

And then, you know, in our sport, you have a 14-minute game, which anything can happen.

I mean, Australia had beaten us throughout.

And then we somehow beat them.

And that bronze medal match.

So it's like...

It doesn't prepare you for that.

And it's very hard afterwards.

I know a lot of athletes go through that because it's a high of high.

And then it's like, all right, get back to your normal life.

For a lot of athletes, it's truly get back to the office or whatever it is.

Can we talk about that bronze medal match?

I don't know if I want to, but I think we probably should.

That moment at the end of the game, can you just give us from your perspective,

can you just describe that moment?

You know what?

When Maddie Levi scored that second try,

I actually remember feeling not stressed about it.

I felt like, okay, that's fine.

We're going to get the ball back and we can do something.

Thankfully, they didn't make the kick.

But then, so they kicked deep.

And I remember the ball bounce.

And I was like, my teammate doesn't catch that.

So she let it bounce in, but one of my teammates got it and she rucked over.

And then we were in that zone, right, where you're not going to want to throw too wild of passes.

You're right by your try zone.

So I got it.

I tried to do what I could.

I was like, well, I gained us no meters.

But I wanted to secure the ball, so I just kind of secured it.

And so I'm on the ground.

The ball's passed out to Spiff.

And Spiff, I don't know what happened.

Well, actually, I do know what happens.

And this is actually a really cool thing about Spiff that I love telling people is,

actually, in college one time, she was about to be tackled that way.

She was kind of tackled over on the end and like fall on her head and she broke her collarbone.

So now she knows whenever she's about to be tackled that way,

kind of like, you know, when they grab the back of your jersey.

Down that she pushes her collarbone up.

She pushes her everything up.

So it was kind of an interesting thing.

I was like, wow, what an effect that she learned that the hard way in college.

Who knew that breaking your collarbone would translate to scoring the winning goal in the Olympics?

That's insane.

Isn't that crazy?

I love that about her.

So she knew she was she beat one tackle and then she's about to get that done on the other tackle.

And she knows she's like she starts driving up her collarbone.

And the thing about Spiff is she's crazy fast.

And I think she's an underrated player.

She's insanely fast.

She just breaks away.

I I'm on the ground like I see her spreading away and I it doesn't register because I'm looking at like, OK, I'm like, OK, time's about to be out trying to add it all up.

She's going.

So I start getting up and jumping.

I guess my dad in the stands is like, where's Maddie Levi?

Because if anybody's going to always comes from nowhere, she comes from nowhere.

And that's we know that.

And so my dad was like, we are all excited.

But we're like, where's Maddie Levi?

And I think if you'd given her five more meters, Maddie could have had it.

Ten, ten meters.

Maddie would have had it.

I mean, that was desperation in that.

So Spiff scores it and then Nia's in there first and then I'm in there second.

But we hadn't calculated it in our heads.

We were just so excited.

We didn't realize we were tied there.

Yeah.

And we weren't sure what's happening.

So I was like, and then we didn't have a kicker on the field.

That was the big thing.

Oh, gosh.

All the kickers were off.

But Spiff had been warming up her kick and warm up and she never does that.

She just warmed it up because the coaches were like, well, you know, maybe just just warm up your kick.

Just because that's how they plan things.

And so she's like, just warm up your kick.

And I remember I get the ball.

I'm still like kind of doing the math in my head.

And they're like, get the ball to her.

So I try.

I give the ball to Spiff like really calmly.

I'm like, because I didn't want to take the kick.

And I wouldn't have been mad if she'd missed this kick because that's so much pressure.

I was like, here you go, Spiff.

You do whatever you get.

You know, I'm like, chill out.

Whatever happens.

But I'm just looking at the uprights.

Yeah.

And she makes that.

And it was so.

I mean, it was crazy.

And I don't think it was.

Still doesn't feel real at times.

But we really wanted that.

And not saying Australia didn't.

It would have been amazing for any program as any team out there would want it.

We wanted it for our team.

I think for funding and whatnot.

And we got a big donation because of it.

Is that the Michelle Kang?

The Michelle Kang donation.

She got $4 million because of that and because of what we'd done.

I think the work was on the field and also off of it.

I mean, we were doing social media as well as a team.

And people were loving it.

So it was amazing.

It was amazing.

Really, what we came for.

Sometimes I'm sad we didn't celebrate it as much as we could have.

USA almost put us on like a.

We were on a media tour.

Like the next day.

It looks like you guys were non-stop.

Crazy.

It was crazy.

I was so.

That night we win.

The day we win.

And then they make us do like a Today Show at like midnight.

So we can't go out and drink with our families.

And then the next day from 11 to 11.

It's a 12 hour media tour.

And we're on with like.

Because NBC runs.

So we're on with this, this, this.

We go from this interview, this interview.

And I'm sweating.

Because I'm.

I'm.

I'm.

It's so hot.

We have these whole things on.

Everybody wants to talk to the TikTok girl.

So I'm having to talk to them.

And they're like.

It was just a lot.

And I never felt like.

That's a big regret.

I never felt like I got to celebrate that with my team.

Because we were just on.

And then we were so tired afterwards.

You played a whole seven tournament.

And then we were so tired.

We just like.

Went home.

And a lot of girls left the Olympics early.

And.

That's something where I.

I.

Get sad about.

Because we.

This was something we.

You know.

Had wanted for so long.

And we did it.

Yeah.

It wasn't a gold.

But to us it felt like a gold.

I mean.

We were joking out.

Joking throughout the day.

It was like rose gold.

Because I think that was almost treated like a gold medal.

It felt like that.

From the outside.

It felt like to you guys.

That was a gold medal.

I.

I think it was.

I think this scenario of it.

Being the first medal.

Yeah.

How we won it.

I mean.

That was an Olympic moment.

That was probably.

One of the best moments of the Paris Olympics.

Was Spiff running across that field.

So.

That was a gold.

I mean.

They.

The media cared about us.

It was a big thing.

And.

I feel very fulfilled.

That we did that.

Yeah.

Like.

I know it wasn't.

Number one.

But.

It felt like it.

Yeah.

Cool.

The TikTok piece.

It was Tokyo.

You blew up already.

When did you start to notice.

Like.

The type of content.

That people were really engaging with.

I think I've always tried to have my.

Almost finger on the pulse of what people like.

I never wanted to pigeonhole myself into just a rugby.

Niche.

Yeah.

Because that's a very small niche in the world.

And that's not a very.

Financial heavy niche.

In terms of marketing and whatnot.

So I never wanted to just be rugby.

I think at the start I was doing some rugby content.

But going into Tokyo.

I remember I made just some like content on.

I think.

Being single in the village.

And I was like.

Oh people respond to this.

Oh yeah.

I just saw the people respond.

To it.

Because people love watching that.

They watch Love Island.

They watch The Bachelor.

And so I just thought it was funny.

Because there was all the talk about the cardboard bed.

So I kind of am always like.

Forecasting.

I'll look through my media.

Okay.

We're talking about this.

Let's see which way I can spin it.

Or people love to see this.

Let me see if I can spin it this way.

So nothing's out of bounds for me.

I.

Make jokes about myself.

I make jokes for.

You know.

Others.

But I just think that.

The way social media can.

Reach people.

And how it's changed my life.

Has been.

I mean.

Crazy.

And that's what all.

Female athletes want.

Right.

We want sponsorships.

We want deals.

And I found that.

That was the way to do that.

Have you found it weird?

Like.

Do you almost feel like people are surprised.

That you are.

A whole well-rounded person.

Like do you think sometimes people put athletes in a box.

Of thinking.

You're a rugby player.

Or you're something else.

Like are people almost like.

Taking it back.

That you are.

Funny.

And well-rounded.

I think they feel that a lot.

Of ways with athletes.

That they're.

Shocked when they're funny.

Or something.

When they have a personality.

Because.

Main part.

Well.

You should just be on the field.

Focus on your sport.

Well that's for.

Three hours in the day.

What about the other.

Parts of the day.

When I'm chatting with my teammates.

So I have found that.

I think people are always.

I always got the comments.

Oh.

You're not taking it seriously.

Or.

You know.

Focus on your sport.

But.

Athletes are some of the funniest people I know.

I mean.

We're the ones.

We're with each other every day.

We're in the locker room.

Josh with each other.

Cracking jokes.

So.

It is interesting.

That they put us in a box.

Like.

You should just be doing this.

And you only can eat this.

And you only should say this.

And all you should be thinking about.

Is rugby.

But I'm in the.

Olympic village in Tokyo.

And we go train for.

Two.

Three hours.

And then I'm stuck in a village.

It's COVID.

Yeah.

So I have a lot of time to do stuff.

You can watch.

Seven's film for.

You know.

14 minutes.

And then you're kind of done.

So.

I've never liked that.

And then on the opposite side.

Now people have put me in the box.

Of the content.

Content creator.

And don't believe in me.

So much as the athlete.

Which is so interesting.

I'm like.

I still want a gold.

I still want a.

Rose gold medal.

Not a gold.

I like how in your head.

It's just become gold.

I just love.

It's a gold.

I respect it.

It's a gold.

I respect it.

I'm going to give you that.

Thank you so much.

It's kind of in the light.

You squint a little bit.

They forget about that as well.

Like that.

Also they can't be.

If you're a content creator.

Good at content.

You're not actually a good athlete.

You're just like.

A mid-athlete.

And that always fires me up.

Because I'm an.

To me.

I'm an athlete first.

I'm a rugby player first.

And then the influencer.

Content creator.

Is just something I do.

Even though that's what makes me.

All my income.

I want to be an athlete first.

Yet they think that.

Because of that.

It takes away from it.

Yes.

There is.

It is almost this belief.

That you can only exist.

Doing one thing well.

Yeah.

Almost at a time.

That wasn't.

That's always been interesting.

Is.

And one guy.

The Olympics.

Hank Green.

His brother.

He made a TikTok about it.

Like people usually are good at one thing.

But he liked that.

I was really good at both things.

And there's more athletes.

That could be.

I just think they're not encouraged to.

Maybe it's the American mindset.

Of like.

We're very much so.

Every man for himself.

I want to get.

You know.

I want to be the best.

Me.

Me.

Me.

Maybe that's a little bit.

What's in me is like.

I want to succeed.

I want to get sponsorships.

I want to be able to live a comfortable life.

Through sport and media.

So I'm going to put myself out there.

Where.

Whereas I think.

I remember.

When I was in New Zealand for.

The World Cup.

I wasn't playing.

But I was just there.

Three years ago.

I learned to like.

Tall.

Tall poppy syndrome.

Yes.

And kind of putting it down.

And I think that's very.

Rampant in rugby as well.

It's always.

When you hear the.

The boys talking about the game.

So.

You just one player.

The match.

You scored five tries.

Two individuals.

And they're like.

All the.

All the boys.

You know.

All them.

Full credit to the boys.

Full credit to the boys.

All them.

You know.

So there is something about it.

Maybe it's the difference in culture.

I think it's shifting a little bit.

Because it doesn't take away.

From my rise.

Has actually.

Risen.

My whole team.

And the whole sport in general.

So I think that.

Hopefully it's shifting.

Rugby is a very stoic sport.

Full of.

A lot of men.

A lot of older white men.

Who have a very.

Maybe older view of what it should be.

Even.

I think the men's players.

Even probably get it worse than I do.

They're so.

Supposed to be.

On the field.

Do your job.

That's it.

You can't have a personality.

They're.

They're made fun of.

For personality.

Or say if they lose a game.

And they post a TikTok.

The day before.

They'll be like.

It's because of the TikTok.

Or even the Jasmine Joyce example.

Was that.

Did you see that one?

Oh my gosh.

Of like her doing the TikTok.

And she got slammed.

I thought the video was great.

It was amazing.

And.

And that's what I love.

And I messaged them both.

And I said that.

You're.

You're starting conversations.

And as my dad says.

All press is good press.

And you're.

Bringing yourself up.

Now people know about Jasmine Joyce.

And.

And now people know about Sarah Byrne.

Like Sarah Byrne's been.

Putting out great content as well.

I just think that people can't separate the two.

That you have to be.

You have to be this.

Athlete.

And that's it.

Jasmine Joyce is one of the best players in the world.

One of the best tacklers in the world.

The girl's also funny as heck.

So it doesn't take away from her ability to tackle.

You touched on this idea of like.

You succeeding helps others to rise.

Bez.

My co-host of our weekly.

Podcast at the Female Athlete Project.

Would die at that.

Because she's obsessed.

With the phrase.

A rising tide lifts all boats.

And we talk about a lot.

It's part of our new merch.

But.

I see what you're doing from your content.

And I feel like.

That to me is what you're doing.

I feel like you have grown a huge amount.

In terms of your following.

But I feel like everywhere you go.

You lift other people up.

You tag other people.

You include them in your content.

I feel like you've really been able to leverage.

What you've achieved to help grow.

Women's sport and women's rugby.

Is that quite a strategic thing?

Or is that just a pretty natural thing for you?

I think it's natural in a way.

I've always been a team sport athlete.

I think it's also strategic.

Because.

Well.

I just make the joke sounds.

Everyone keeps calling me the superstar of rugby.

And I'm like I'm tired.

We cannot have one.

Because that's not enough for our sport.

We need more.

We need people to go out and watch Sarah Byrne play.

And go out because they want to see Jasmine Joyce play.

Or Charlotte Kastlick.

Like we need that.

It can't just because like.

Oh Alone is playing.

Let's go to this one game.

Like in the PWR.

That was my thing is in the PWR.

I was scared.

Yeah it's great we're getting out these numbers.

For these games that I'm playing in.

But.

I don't know.

But I'm probably not going to play next year.

Are we still going to get the numbers?

We need more to grow the game.

I think I'm at a comfortable point to where.

I mean.

Not that I'm untouchable.

But I've worked very hard.

And I've you know grown, grown, grown, grown, grown.

I just don't see it as like.

Like I don't think I'm ever going to get bashed down.

Or something like that.

I'm not afraid of somebody coming over and overtaking me.

If somebody overtakes me.

Awesome.

That's great.

Like let's get another superstar.

Because I'm again very tired.

Okay.

I cannot do more interviews.

I cannot.

So can we get more?

Like I want these girls to rise up.

And I give them little pointers.

Like do this.

Do this.

Do this.

It's about now.

I think them taking it.

And being prepared.

And it's a vulnerability they have to have.

It's a very vulnerable thing to put yourself online like that.

And I think they're doing it.

I just am trying to be like the catalyst for it.

Like I make a lot of videos for my teammates.

Like Sarah Byrne.

I would make a video in Bears.

And I would keep.

I would give me your phone.

And I would create it.

And then post it for her.

Just because I have the mind of it.

And so I send videos to my teammates constantly.

Like this is a great video for you.

Go make it.

Because it's just rising tide lifts all boats.

If we can all just keep getting.

If all of us keep getting better.

The sport keeps getting better.

We all get more notoriety.

So it just has felt natural.

And I think that my teammates are some of the best people around there.

I wouldn't be where I am without them.

Like I wouldn't be this confident without Nia Tapper.

Making me feel so good about myself all the time.

Or Nicole Havlin.

My best friend.

Who always.

Helps me.

So I just want there to be more stars.

I think we need that.

I think we need people to go out to games.

To see individuals.

That's fine.

That's what is making sports rise.

Like when you think of Ronda Rousey for the UFC.

They went out to see Ronda Rousey.

Yeah.

If you go out to see me.

And then you get exposed to these other players.

That's awesome.

That's what we want.

Yeah.

You touched on the vulnerability piece.

And it just made me think of you as that awkward kid.

Who would.

Linger.

On the outside of the circle.

Like it's a pretty.

Stark change to now be in a position where you do feel so comfortable.

To be vulnerable in front of a global audience.

I don't know how I got there fully.

I think it was.

The teammates around me.

Who make me feel confident to do that.

I always.

The story I tell about Nia Tapper always is.

Being a big girl.

I would look around and see my other teammates on USA.

And they wouldn't be eating that much.

I'm like okay.

Maybe I need to eat as much as them.

And then we were at a buffet once.

And Nia Tapper goes to me like.

No you should be eating more.

You're a big girl.

That's a fact.

You know.

She didn't say that.

But I was like oh that's a fact.

I'm a big girl.

I need to eat more.

And so having somebody who's like.

Like a sport like rugby that just praises that.

I don't really know how I've gotten over it.

It's.

I'm definitely very awkward at heart.

I still.

I think what.

I've done is now just accepted it.

And I think awkwardness is a thing that also.

Brings people together.

And makes people feel comfortable.

So when I am awkward.

Is.

If in some way I'm awkward to you.

And then you're like okay.

She's kind of weird.

Perfect.

Like we're.

Now you feel better about it.

To hang out with me.

Totally.

So I.

Don't mind the awkwardness.

I've kind of controlled it.

I'm.

I can make any situation awkward.

Truly.

But.

I think it's a kind of a power to have.

Of making people feel comfortable.

And connected.

And not feeling judged.

And I still.

At many times.

I think I'm trying to actually figure out.

Still who I am.

And step into that role.

And believe that I can be that role.

Believe that I'm the.

The boss businesswoman now.

And that I deserve to be that.

And that I have power now.

And that's something I'm really trying to hone in on.

Is that.

You know.

When I walk into a room.

It's.

I am.

Alone Amara.

I've done a lot of work to get there.

But it is.

They're still lingering insecurities constantly.

Can we talk about the.

CNN.

Imposter syndrome.

Of course.

Yeah.

I was shocked they posted that.

I was like.

Why would you post that?

That was.

Yeah.

That went absolutely viral.

And it resonated with a lot of people.

Are you like.

Were you just like.

Why did you ask me that lady?

Well.

I get asked that a lot.

So.

Do you?

Oh yeah.

I.

And I posted a video before.

Like weeks before about it.

Because she'd asked me.

And I was like.

I don't know.

So then I posted a little TikTok.

Not saying anything.

Who it was.

But posted about.

The imposter syndrome.

Because I always get asked that.

I'm like.

How do you deal with it?

I'm like.

What are you talking about?

I was.

I was at practice earlier.

I was working my butt off earlier.

You know.

Yeah.

So this idea.

I think this.

Forced humbleness on women.

I.

I don't appreciate.

And I think that.

Women are almost told to have it.

Because then it will seem good.

You'll seem really approachable.

You know.

You don't want to be too much.

It's.

If you say.

And people just say they have imposter syndrome.

I think to say it.

To seem like.

Boy.

And humble.

But I think it's a false sense of humbleness at times.

There's.

Times to be humble.

But a lot of times.

These women.

Women work so hard.

And a lot of times.

If they're in a role.

They.

Are supposed to be there.

There's like.

Probably.

There's been studies.

Out.

You know.

For basketball.

For coaches.

A man can play.

Middle school basketball.

And he's like.

Yeah.

I can.

I can coach the high school basketball team.

That'll be fine.

A woman will be like.

I didn't make the WNBA.

I probably can't coach this team.

You know.

That's so true.

So we're overqualified.

At times.

And yet.

We still don't believe that.

We deserve to.

To be there.

And I just find it to be so funny.

I.

Whenever people say they have imposter syndrome.

I'm like.

What are you talking about?

You've worked so hard.

It's.

It's.

You can have it.

Of course.

If you have it.

You have it.

But I think.

Don't forget how hard you've worked.

And don't let people minimize that.

It's not.

Maybe boasting.

It's just about being.

It's a fact.

You've worked to get there.

You've worked hard to get there.

Don't let somebody.

Think that.

False modesty is the key.

Question.

A couple of questions that I ask everyone on the podcast.

Is.

Firstly.

Who has had the biggest impact on you as a person?

Probably my sisters.

As a duo.

I think that.

My oldest sister.

For sure.

We were.

We were.

We were always very.

Similar in age.

Similar in hanging out.

We did a lot of things together.

And then.

Even my younger sister.

Now.

I think that they're my influencers.

I call them.

Whatever they do.

I do.

And then the.

Then the world sees.

And they do.

So.

Having sisters is a blessing.

And.

Having sisters who are supportive.

Who look like you.

Who.

Love you like that.

Really.

Helps you go through.

I think the world.

And the challenges.

How's it been doing the podcast with your sisters?

It's epic.

It's been good.

It's been good.

I think it's.

It's kind of weird.

Because it's just us.

On our.

You know.

Chatting.

Like how we do.

All the time.

On video calls.

So.

It's been fun.

Sometimes I'm like.

We're just saying.

We just keep talking.

Because we have so much more we can say.

But it's been really fun.

And also to get.

Rising tide lifts all boats.

Like for me.

I'm lifting.

And I.

Cool to see my sisters come with me as well.

It's been fun.

We have so much.

We want to talk about.

And we want.

I've been so busy.

With the.

With rugby.

I want to get.

So we can just do it constantly.

Just say what's happening.

And going on in our days.

Because.

I don't think we've ever been afraid to share.

We've never been afraid to show people.

Real women.

And.

Our thoughts and feelings.

Yeah.

I love that.

Next question is.

What has been your favorite failure?

That's good.

Because I'm always asked like.

What would you want to change.

From.

You know.

What would you go back and tell yourself.

What would you want to change.

And.

I think like.

Failures like that.

Like.

Everything has led to.

Where I'm at now.

In a way.

My failure was.

The friends that I didn't make.

I think.

Or the friends that I thought were my friends.

At times.

Those little things.

And those little experiences.

Are what kind of led me to this path now.

Like.

It's hard to explain.

It's very like.

Personal things.

But the.

The.

Relationships that I thought I had.

That weren't actually right.

Like.

Those little failures in a way.

I wouldn't change.

I wouldn't change how hurt I was.

How much it changed me.

I think it's.

What has led me to here.

And.

You know.

Young.

Alone.

She was so.

Brave and strong.

To go through that.

So.

I.

I think the.

Failures.

I love that.

Favorite failure.

Oh my gosh.

I'll have to keep thinking.

Because I've done.

There's so many.

So many.

Yeah.

It's a tricky.

It's a tricky.

It stumps.

But I should have given you a heads up.

Do you have one?

What's your favorite failure?

My favorite failure.

I.

I went to.

An interview.

For a women's sports podcast.

With a gambling company.

I won't name which gambling company it was.

And.

I rocked it.

I rocked up.

This was.

I was playing.

I'd finished sevens.

I was playing AFLW at the time.

I'd moved down to Melbourne.

And I rocked up to this interview.

And I think they were.

It was going to be like a very casual podcast.

But I rocked up with like.

Pages of paper.

Of like notes.

That I'd prepared.

To like be ready.

And I was so nervous.

And I like.

I ended up.

After I stood up.

I was not myself at all.

In the interview.

I was really.

Really like.

Awkward.

And.

I didn't really speak my mind.

At all.

Because I was so worried.

About them judging what I was saying.

To see whether I'd be good on the podcast.

And I stood up.

And I remember.

I dropped my papers all over the floor.

And I was mortified.

And I didn't get the job.

But.

Only a few months later.

I started the Female Athlete Project.

And it's grown to be.

The.

Like.

It gives me the most purpose.

More than.

More than sport ever has.

You know.

Playing sport ever has.

Like.

Waking up and doing this every day.

Has given me so much purpose.

And I'm so glad.

I'm not sitting hosting.

The podcast on a gambling company.

For their women's sports podcast.

There you go.

Thank me mom.

That worked out mom.

I like that.

I love the little moments that.

You don't realize it.

And then lead to this.

Where you're at now.

That's why I like that question.

Is it snack time?

Are we doing Aussie snack time?

Snack time.

Snack time.

Snack time.

What do we got?

Okay.

So we got.

We're going to rank.

Do we have seven?

You're going to rank.

One to seven.

Are we on?

I'm excited.

I'm starving.

I'm so glad I got my own plate.

Okay.

Okay.

Thank you to Aussie icons.

Budgie smuggler.

We're going to rank seven iconic Aussie foods.

What do you want to start with?

Let's start with the sprinkly toast thing here.

Fairy bread.

Fairy bread.

Did you make this?

This is iconic.

Producer Soph has made this from scratch.

This is like kids birthday party.

Like you want fairy bread at a kid's birthday party.

Great lines here.

You killed the border.

Okay.

Okay.

It's so good.

Yeah.

I mean, it's sprinkles on toast.

Like what are you going to, you know, it's just butter and sprinkles, right?

Uh-huh.

My mom is Dutch and they have something like this.

Oh, she's Dutch.

This white bread's really slapping too.

That is basic.

I'm into it.

I'm into it.

I'm going to keep going while you.

Do I have to rank it now or can I wait?

Can I go through all and then rank?

I feel like you have to rank it now.

Ah, okay.

Fine.

Rank it now.

And then if you hate it,

we'll rank at the end

and we'll pretend you never ranked it.

Okay, perfect.

Rank that three.

Okay.

These are shapes, I'm assuming.

Shapes.

Pizza shapes.

Mmm.

It's like a pizza goldfish.

What's a goldfish?

That's crazy.

It's, um, it is literally just a, it's a cracker in the form of a, of a, uh, fish.

And we love them.

Pizza flavor?

Yeah, they do pizza flavor, regular flavor.

Cause I would say barbecue shapes are better.

Okay, where are we going?

Um, I just know there's a Tim Tam.

That'll probably be one.

I'm going to go two.

I like, I like pizza shapes.

Going high early.

Oh wait, what's this?

Have you had a caramel koala before?

Caramel koala?

I'll probably love it.

Can't wait.

You've gone really high early, I reckon.

I know.

I just see that badge in my hand.

I know that bad boy's hitting a seven.

Oh, that low, you know, already.

Well, it's a nice spread.

Maybe if there was cheese on there.

Sssss.

Producer, maybe if we weren't skimping around here, put some real cheese on this.

Or ham, if you want.

Or some ham.

I thought that's what you did.

I'm going caramel-o.

Mm-hmm.

Delicious.

First time?

I don't think I've had this before.

Very good.

Beautiful.

But aren't the Aussie girls sponsored by Cadbury?

Yes.

What a sponsor to have.

Great sponsor.

So these in a bigger, you can get them in a bigger koala and lots of people, when they

were fundraising for sport would sell, carry around a box and sell them for a dollar.

Mm-hmm.

Which is a very iconic part of a sporting childhood in Australia.

Yeah.

We would do something like that with bars and candy, Snickers and whatnot.

Freddo Fogg.

Yeah.

It's delicious.

Where are you going to put it?

What are your thoughts on Hershey's versus American Chocolate versus Cadbury?

That's a tough question.

I find Hershey's is quite sweet in comparison, do you reckon?

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Like the little kisses?

I do quite like a little kiss.

They're fine.

Oh.

I think Cadbury's better.

What's like?

When you're talking Hershey's, what's your go-to Hershey's?

The thing is the only time I'm going to eat a Hershey's bar is if it's in a s'mores.

That's the only right, that's the right time to eat a Hershey's bar.

Yeah.

Right.

Okay.

Toasted marshmallow with some graham cracker.

That's the only chocolate I think I eat with a s'more too.

What's in a Hershey's bar?

Is it just plain chocolate?

Yeah.

Milk chocolate.

Like a Cadbury block.

Yes.

Yes.

Yeah.

I got you.

But different.

Sweeter.

Sweeter.

Yeah.

It's like a four, I guess.

These are all very good.

We're doing it again too.

You should've thrown in some really nasty ones.

Okay.

What's this?

What is this?

Oh, lamington.

I like a lamington.

You know what?

I might've tried this like a year ago with like Maddie Levi.

Oh, is this milk?

Oh, Milo.

Bring in.

Have you done Milo?

Pretty much.

Yeah.

I love to nab it with some tea.

Okay.

Meh, meh.

Not that fast.

Meh, meh.

I'm just spat coconut out of here.

Five.

You're good.

Five.

I'd give it a six.

Oh, it's low.

So they do it with, like, old sponge.

Like, this is not old sponge.

This is from the supermarket, but that's, like, the concept.

Old sponge, and then they soak it up in chocolate.

Six.

I don't know about it.

Six.

Six.

Where are we going next?

Tim Tam?

Tim Tam.

Well, let's go Vegemite so I can wash it down with some.

Maybe I will like it.

Okay, here we go.

I don't know how to look like her.

Um, um, um.

Mm.

Um.

Um.

Um.

Mm.

I think it would be better with cheese.

What is that?

Almost a Burt taste or something to it.

It's got something about it.

Because it's salty, right?

Yeah.

In its essence, it's very salty.

Too much?

I think I would eat it with cheese.

Okay.

We'll take the feed back on board.

But I'm still ranking that a seven for sure.

Okay.

I don't know the point of that.

Is it good for your microbiome or something?

It probably is, to be honest.

Got a lot of vitamin B12 around these parts.

Do you want Milo or Tim Tam next?

Let's go with the Milo because I've tried Tim Tam before.

Yeah, scoop it in.

And by tried Tim Tams, I mean I've eaten a lot of Tim Tams in my day.

Okay.

Milo is like, some people do the ratio of the cup is almost completely Milo.

Like it's like thick.

We might need to give you a bit more.

A solid.

You don't have a lot of room to work with.

Good luck to you.

Are you lactose free?

We just got full cream.

No, I drink dairy.

Is this like Nesquik?

I think it's probably Nesquik.

I reckon it's better.

I reckon it's way better.

Yeah.

Well, you guys would say that.

Okay.

I don't know if this is going to mix well.

Just I reckon get a top bit, but don't breathe it in.

You know what I'm saying?

That was low.

A little gritty.

Let me just taste it on its own.

This is it's Nestle.

Huh?

Okay.

I'm this is probably not advised, but.

Oh, you're going solo powder.

Yeah.

Well, it's not mixing well.

Okay.

Delicious.

One thing about me.

I love instant like hot chocolate.

Okay.

And it's giving that.

This is our gift to you.

Oh my gosh.

Thank you.

You don't want to fly with it.

It's, um, it's a tough one to stir.

I almost need a cocktail shaker.

You want me to give you a proper stir of your Milo.

It's a skill.

I reckon.

How much Milo are you drinking?

As a kid dead set.

Yeah.

It was like, it was like a get home from school.

Yeah.

A daily activity.

See, it's a skill.

You got to like build up the tornado and it just gradually.

Okay.

All right.

What are we next?

Wait, where'd you write Milo?

Milo's delicious.

I'm going to give it a five.

See sad.

It could be higher.

It could be higher, but I, my whole ranking system is off.

My whole rating system is, is in the gutter.

Thank you.

I don't know if it's that much better, but you've got a bit more going on.

Still gritty and I'm chewing it, but it's good.

Yummy.

All right.

Tim, Tim, where this is ending up.

No tea producer.

Oh my God.

This is a prison.

I can't work in these conditions.

It's delicious.

Good dip in the Milo.

No, bad.

No, it's not the same as tea.

Yeah.

So good.

Can't go wrong.

You can't go wrong with a Tim Tam.

Are Tim Tams always double chocolate?

I think this is standard.

You can get double coat.

Have you had the double coat?

The blue, dark blue pack.

Have.

They're good.

I've asked the camera one.

Hmm.

Like a caramel, a koala in a Tim Tam.

Yeah.

Caramel.

One's a yummy, delicious.

Okay.

That's number one.

Number one.

Redo your rank from now.

Wait.

Cause if he had everything, got everything.

Yeah.

One.

What's your seven?

Seven.

So my mate, a six is still a sponge cake.

Five is the sprinkles.

Fairy bread.

Um, four is the Milo.

Three is the.

Pizza shapes, then caramel, koalas and Timmy Tammys.

Pizza shapes were way higher than I thought.

No, I'm going to eat them again.

I actually am really messing with these.

So, so maybe Timmy Tammys, Timmy Tammys.

Yeah, no one's are calling that they have to have called that year.

I like that a lot.

I feel like it's weird to go serious after doing that very fun segment, but I'm genuinely very thankful for your time for someone who gets pulled in.

I imagine a crazy amount of directions.

I'm really thankful for you giving us the time and space to come and have a chat and for your vulnerability as well, for sharing your story.

So thank you so much.

Thank you for having me.

This was awesome to end with snacks.

What, what I only request is awesome.

Um, no, thank you.

And this is so cool.

What your podcast is doing for sport, not only in Australia, in the world.

I mean, it's so cool to see the, the numbers you guys are doing all over and I get shared posts from you guys so much and you're covering sports of every realm.

So I think that's really impactful because it's.

Like, as I say, it's not just rugby, that's changing lives.

It's every sport.

And if you can do any sport and see what your body's capable of, it's important.

So awesome.

Appreciate that.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

And thank you for my shapes.

Yeah.

More paid to show like re in my cheek.

I was saying, I love that.

How good.

Thank you very much.

Of course.

No, thank you.

Thanks so much for listening.

If you got something out of this episode, I would absolutely love it.

If you could send it on to one person who you think might enjoy it.

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