Dr Chris Brown Australia_S Favourite Vet

This week's conversation is with one of Australia's most popular and respected people.

Dr. Chris Brown is not only a vet, but an Australian television presenter and author.

He's best known for the television series Bondi Vet, The Living Room,

and for co-hosting I'm a Celebrity, Get Me Out of Here alongside Julia Morris.

Dr. Chris Brown is an inspiring modern leader

and he's changing the game in the animal welfare space in this country.

His passion for what he does is one of the fundamentals for the work that we do

at our leadership business, Alita.

And we feel incredibly privileged to work and collaborate with outstanding people

like Chris at Alita.

If you're interested in leading, learning and collaborating,

you can find it all at alitacollective.com.

There are some great resources there.

Encourage you to check out our signature Alita Connect program to get started

and to understand how like Dr. Chris Brown, you're leading in your world.

Dr. Chris Brown is an Australian veterinarian, television personality and author.

He is well known for his work as the Bondi Vet,

the host of The Living Room and I'm a Celebrity, Get Me Out of Here.

Chris grew up in the suburb of Merriweather Heights in Newcastle, New South Wales,

attending Merriweather High School.

He went on to study at the University of Sydney where he graduated in 2001

with first class honours in veterinary science.

He has a strong family history in animal care with his auntie and father,

both qualified vets.

And Chris, to me, holds a very unique place in Australian public life

as one of the country's most loved, respected and trusted people.

Dr. Chris Brown, always great to see you.

Das.

Das.

I mean, second to you when it comes to being loved and respected.

The unfortunate part about that statement is that there's data to back up my thoughts on you, Chris.

The research actually comes up every year and, mate, it's true.

I mean, I've been lucky enough to be in your company several times

and it feels like that is your superpower, Chris, to be honest with you.

You've got a positive energy in every scenario that I've seen you

whenever we see you on TV.

Is that just you or is that something you've had to work on?

No, look, I think when you are a vet, you have to have a positive mindset

because I think being a vet, it's a great leveller.

I always laugh about, you know, the moment I step back into the vet clinic.

I still do work in the vet.

A lot of people think I sort of don't do that anymore.

But you can go in and it's a great example of almost gallows humour

or it's just got a great way of cutting you down a couple of pegs.

But I always, if I've been away on a work trip somewhere really interesting

or the classic one is, you know, the morning after the Logies,

like the next shift I do, I always, whether the vet hospital arranges

this for me or not, but they always have this sort of cavalcade of dogs

with various forms of explosive diarrhoea waiting for me.

And so you've just got to laugh.

Like animals don't care who you are, what you do,

how you do it.

How your day's going.

They're just there.

They don't want to be there, but they just judge you according

to how you present yourself, probably how you smell, to be fair.

And then, you know, it's up to you to win them over.

So you're no one in the animal world.

And I think I kind of like that judgment-free zone in a way.

See, I think animals have got this great intuition too, though.

The family pets especially, they are on to energy in a way that perhaps

humans take a bit longer to catch up on.

I think when your dog warms to someone, it's normally a good sense.

I mean, are people, when you come out, you know, you're back on the tools,

you know, are they sort of surprised that you're still doing what you do?

Yeah.

I think it's a big part of why I enjoy being on the tools is really, I mean,

just for the reactions of clients when you walk into that waiting room

and you're like, oh.

I mean, I'm here for Puffin and they're like, you?

And I'm like, yeah, me.

And they're like, are you really a vet?

I'm like, yes.

Like, I'm not an actor.

Like, all these years I haven't been pretending to be a vet.

I mean, I've gone full method, clearly, for many, many years.

I even had one guy a few months ago and I walked him through

and I think his dog was just there for a vaccination.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And he said, mate, I know you.

And I just, I didn't want to say anything because the moment you say,

oh, yeah, I do a bit of TV, they're like, they usually say, no,

I don't watch TV.

That can't be it.

And you just feel like an idiot.

So I just, I just like said, you know, I don't know.

I don't know.

I don't know what it might be.

And, and I proceeded to look at his dog and, and, you know,

take the temperature in the conventional veterinary way.

And, and I got to the end of it and he goes, I got it.

I bloody well got it.

And I said, what, what is it?

And he goes, I know who you are.

And I said, who am I?

And he goes, you're the guy who plays that vet on TV.

Again, I'm not an actor.

It's a convincing performance, hopefully.

But yeah, a lot of, a lot of study went into that, into that,

into that misconception that I'm just an actor that,

that plays the role of a vet on TV.

I find that very amusing all around.

I think the thing that people, you know,

perhaps one of the reasons why we all connect with you,

you can see when you're around animals,

there is this genuine care and love.

And I mentioned the family history in the intro.

Can you remember at a young age, Chris, was that in your mind,

were you thinking working with animals was going to be a big part of your life?

Yeah, I was, as you say, my dad was the local vet and, and, you know,

the earliest memories are of being around a lot, a lot of animals.

Like it was, it was not a normal upbringing.

Like we had, we had the standard dog and, and cats.

But, you know,

at different times we'd have like koalas living in the shed,

like in the, in the laundry, we'd have possums.

We had a lot of chickens.

We had a cow, we had sheep.

We had like, I had a pet wallaby called Wally,

imaginative name for, for six months.

I had a pet penguin when I was a kid.

So this penguin had washed ashore.

It was molting and couldn't go back out into the ocean.

And dad brought it home.

And, and, you know,

he, in,

in three, I'm one of three boys.

So dad had this sort of very mobile,

very cheap labor force that he could put into,

into any cases,

any animals that needed care overnight.

And, and yeah,

for, for a few months I had this penguin and I used

to feed this penguin little,

little fish,

you know,

little pilchards and, and try to build up at strength.

And the only way to know if it was ready to

go back in the water was to,

to put it in the family swimming pool.

And so I just threw it into the pool and,

and, and,

you know,

it's it dart around and you couldn't get the bloody

thing out.

So when,

when,

when it got to the point where you couldn't actually fish

the penguin out with the leaf scoop out of the pool,

you realize this,

this penguin can probably go back to the wild now.

And so it did.

And we took it down to the local beach and it

sort of waddled its way into the water.

So, but my,

my childhood was just full of those.

There's very odd on reflection memories of,

of these different animals and looking after them.

And, and I guess all the,

all the uplifting sort of,

beautiful nurturing learnings that you get from,

from being exposed to lots and lots of different types of

animals, but also the heartbreak,

like there's no greater leveler,

I think,

than, than witnessing an animal just pass away in your

hands, you know?

And, and it's,

I think as a,

as a kid,

that's the first exposure you have to,

to death.

And, and you know,

there's, there's a lot of,

a lot of heartbreak as a,

as a kid with,

with those animals you care for.

And, and dad,

dad being the matter of fact sort of experienced vet he,

vet he is,

you know,

he, he used to sort of console me by saying,

you know,

when his favorite saying it was when you've got livestock,

you've got dead stock.

And that,

that really summed up,

it's summed it up in such a beautiful emotive and caring

way, I think.

So I promised myself pretty,

so I wasn't going to do what I'm I've done this to

you before.

And I'm sure you want to know you want to,

you want a pet question.

I want an update.

You know,

that's coming.

I said,

don't do it.

But it was more of a reflection a bit on what

you were saying there in our house and having the animals

there and seeing like the kids will fight each other as

a, as we all do growing up,

but the love they pour into the family pet,

our 14 year old Labrador Leroy,

when he died,

seriously,

the people who don't love animals,

don't quite understand our oldest is 19.

Sam, it was a three year process for him.

He still has pictures of,

you know,

as you said,

you get sort of taught that,

how to deal with grief at a young age.

Don't you?

It's a,

there's a window into the soul.

Did your other brothers,

have they got the same love that you've had?

Did that rub off on them as well or not?

Yeah.

Yeah,

they do.

Um,

they,

they all working in sciencey fields on the youngest of the

three and one works in human health.

Uh,

and the other one is an environmental engineer.

Um,

but,

but they're,

they're big dog lovers.

They've,

they've got dogs and,

and,

and they've always had an eye for wildlife and,

and really quite passionate about conservation and,

and all those,

all those different messages.

And I think when it's just around you that whole time,

um,

you just,

you do develop,

you know,

it's,

it's kind of like the earliest form of training in a way

it just becomes part of you.

And you,

you do,

you do develop that eye for,

for what's not quite right.

Um,

and,

and how you can,

how you can use that sort of gentle,

caring nature to,

to help.

And I think that sort of flow,

you never really lose that.

And I think that's why it's so great that the kids are

exposed.

To,

to pets and,

and,

and,

um,

you know,

learn,

learn how to look after them.

So sliding door moment is big for you.

2003,

a couple of years out of,

uh,

had a vet school.

You're in a pub in Sydney as a,

as legend has it,

uh,

telling stories to,

from what I understand and what I've read a girl at the

bar about how good you were going as a vet,

uh,

Chris,

I can picture it.

And,

and,

uh,

a guy who works in media over here is,

and thinks he can make you the next,

uh,

Dr.

Harry Cooper was probably the,

the only event we had on TV.

And in those days,

Dr.

Harry,

you go on and,

and it's a global success story or success story,

you know,

television around the world.

Do you look back and life defining and changing moment from,

you know,

I think your ambition was to be a country vet and look

after farm animals.

And now you've had this incredible pivot in your life.

Do you look back and think my life's much better for it,

or is that hard to quantify?

It's an interesting question because I actually do spend

probably too much time thinking about that moment.

And,

uh,

and wondering,

you know,

what if I was,

I was,

I'd only been an actual vet for,

for about three years.

And,

and,

you know,

you come out of,

you come out of university pretty green and,

and you,

you learn a lot on the,

on the job in those first few years.

So I was only really getting to the stage where I felt like I could handle myself and,

and,

and manage,

um,

manage myself independently.

And I was a week away from giving my notice to go and work in the UK as that sort of mixed

practice,

dog,

cow,

horse kind of vet.

That was always my dream.

You know,

that,

that all creatures,

great and small kind of ideal was,

was,

was very big.

Um,

and,

uh,

I was a week away from,

from doing that when I was in that pub.

And it was a Thursday night.

I,

I didn't,

you know,

probably should point out,

I didn't have to work the Friday.

Um,

and I was,

I was a fair few,

um,

fair few schooners in from memory.

And the stories may have been a little embellished,

but I'd,

I'd had a,

um,

cat that week that had been,

um,

we,

uh,

it was,

it was,

it was quite sad actually.

This cat had been shot,

um,

on the main streets of neutral by in Sydney.

Now,

if,

if anyone knows Sydney,

they'll know that there's the streets of neutral by and not mean,

um,

they're,

they're,

they're not really,

not really straight either.

They're more sort of like tree lined avenues.

Um,

but,

but somehow someone had,

someone had procured,

uh,

I think it was an air rifle and,

and shot his cat.

And,

and when they came on the street,

they'd been doing surgery on him.

And,

and for some reason I taught this girl about this and,

and,

and I,

I,

the drinks were taking a long time to be poured dust.

That's why the story kind of got away from me,

and all the while,

this guy was there listening and nodding.

And,

and he thought I was making up being a vet to impress this girl.

And he just wanted to know what I actually did in real life.

And I said,

no,

I'm a really a vet and he said,

and said,

look,

if you really are a vet,

I've got an idea.

I,

I think there's an,

there's a,

the world of animals and vets and get away from sort

of the white lab coat idea and kind of similar

to what Jamie Oliver has done in cooking where

the conventional chef was replaced by someone a bit more

sort of freewheeling and a bit more natural

and a bit more sort of, you know, spur of the moment.

That was kind of the idea and I was all for that

because I sort of, I do find that sometimes find

the world of veterinary science can be a bit stuffy

and a bit precise and I think it's nice to kind

of freshen it up a little bit.

And so, yeah, from being in the pub to doing a screen test

was a week and all of a sudden I found myself auditioning

for this role I didn't even know existed.

It was at the time when there were a lot of those punked,

like prank TV shows around and it happened so quickly.

I was convinced that I was involved in one of those

and so I used to...

I used to turn up to my first couple...

I got the role in Harry's Practice and it happened

so easily seemingly and so quickly that I used

to turn up 20 minutes early just on the off chance

I might be able to see them setting up the hidden cameras

to catch them out with this prank.

Yeah, yeah.

I was that paranoid.

It probably says a lot about me.

And so I was convinced that it wasn't real

and then progressively over those couple of weeks

there were no hidden cameras and it was actually a real thing.

So, yeah.

And I think if I didn't go to the pub that night,

I went off to the UK, I think I would have loved it.

I think I would have had a great time, a great life.

I probably would have been a bit more settled

in the more conventional sense than I probably am now

but I would have found it fulfilling.

I would have loved what I did but this is the path

that I somehow ended up on and I do love it.

And I think I love it because it allows me to be kind of this...

It's sort of almost like a tautology

but this scientific creative, you know, backed by science

but able to innovate and do something a little bit different

which in the field of the veterinary world,

you kind of do things a certain way

but it's nice to be able to break that a little bit

and tell stories in a, I guess, a more entertaining,

more free-flowing style.

And clearly there's a creative part of your brain

and we know you love your photography.

You surf and clearly you get to use, you know,

and still practice the veterinary, you know, skills

and, you know, bring that to all of us in our lounge rooms.

As they say, the TV world, Chris, is, you know,

got a fair share of ego and politics attached to it.

From my experience, it can be quite a brutal environment

but when I see you, I see your emotional intelligence

and, you know, the integrity comes out

and I feel like when I watch you on TV,

we're barricading for the good guy, you know.

We want more of that.

I mean, has that sense of leadership been what you've tried to bring to TV

or is it, again, am I overthinking this?

Is this just you being you?

No, I think it is a – it's definitely there, that mindset of not –

you know, never want to – there are enough horror stories

and I think you're exposed to enough after, you know,

I've been doing TV for – it's almost – I think it's 18, 19 years now,

which is crazy.

You see enough and you're exposed to enough,

especially in your early days when you're just sort of starting out.

You see enough to realise, oh, man, I never want to be like that

and I think growing up in Newcastle, very much, you know,

even though it's a big city, it's very much a working class town

and you're constantly reminded to never get ahead of yourself

because you're not from the big city, you're not from Sydney,

you're from Newcastle.

Newcastle people don't talk about themselves.

They don't sort of gloat over their achievements.

They never put anyone down unless you're a tall poppy

and then absolutely cut them to the floor.

And so I think that's kind of how you're brought up

and being the youngest of three boys as well, my God,

like there was never any opportunity to get ahead of yourself.

If you had a good game of footy on the weekend or a good game of cricket,

you know, that was – that was – you know, that was – you know,

that was kind of squeezed out of you by Saturday afternoon pretty quickly.

So, yeah, it's – I think it's just – it's just how I like to –

I like to be disarming.

I like to feel like people can, I don't know, trust me

and feel comfortable in my presence because I think starting out in TV,

there are plenty of moments where you're not made to feel comfortable

and that stays – that really stays with you because of that ego

that you're exposed to and that intimidating atmosphere of,

you know, almost that protectionist kind of mindset

where people are almost trying to squeeze you out

or test you to see what you're really made of.

And you see that enough and you think, you know what,

I don't really want to put other people through that.

That's just not really entirely fair.

My mind, Chris, is going to a story that haunts me to this day

and I get reminded of it.

You know, when you work in the media, you get these things sent back your way

a little bit.

But I – it was 2002, I think I was in contention, Chris, let's say,

without being –

overdramatic, as one of the handful of favourites to win the Brownlow Medal.

So I had a reasonable year.

I didn't have many great years, Chris, but I had a reasonable year.

Darcy, come on.

No, no humility.

Plenty of good years.

And I get the call from the production company saying,

we're broadcasting the Brownlow Medal.

Understand you've opened a new pub.

We'd love to send a camera to your new pub and shoot the family.

And I just said, under no circumstances in the world,

that will look like I'm hosting a party.

Like this is like – and one,

I don't think I'm going to win it.

We didn't win enough games.

So under no circumstances, no.

So I must have got the call back from the –

and you know what it's like.

The producer of that line segment had been told, you need to get that.

And those guys are under their own set of pressures.

He must have called back 10 times.

And I just said no every time.

But on I think the 11th time he rang and said, well,

there's nine favourites in the betting market for the Brownlow.

You're the only one of the nine that's not doing something, you know,

attached to something they're passionate about.

So look,

if you still don't want to do it, that's fine.

I went, oh, well, just open a new pub.

Good, you know, a little bit of promo.

My dad is the quietest, was the quietest, humblest guy of all time.

I've convinced dad, you know, you need to be there.

Mum's there.

So Brownlow night.

And Julie, Chris, I don't poll many votes, you know, as –

but any time I didn't poll a vote,

they panned to the Angler's Tavern Out pub at the time where it looks like

I'm hosting a party for – and I remember sitting there going,

this is just an unbelievable nightmare.

And I still get texts, Brownlow night.

Are you going to host another party for yourself?

But –

Isn't it interesting?

Yeah, and that's – it's such a great example of how you should always trust your gut.

Yeah.

And you kind of know who you are and what you represent,

I think, better than anyone else.

And you've sort of put your – once you've worked around TV enough,

you realise that that producer was just getting orders from someone else

and they were just following up.

They were just trying to –

tick the box for the day and honour the request

and be seen to be doing a thorough job of it.

And if they could get you across the line,

then that was a tick in their column for the week.

But, yeah, it's – once it goes through multiple sets of hands,

those sort of situations are out of control.

I remember, like, a couple of years ago, an example of a similar thing.

I was asked to give –

a comment on – it was one of those things, you know,

do you have any New Year's resolutions?

And, you know, it's one of those common little media call-arounds

where they're like, oh, tell us your New Year's resolution.

And I'd done it so many years in a row, I thought, oh, God, I just –

I want to provide a bit of extra value.

And this is kind of – this sort of sums me up to a T

and probably to a fault as well because I thought,

I'm not just going to say something just boring.

I want to entertain people.

I want to give them something that they'll at least look at

and go, oh, yeah, that's a good – that's a good response.

And so I said to the – I wrote back to the journal.

I said, my New Year's resolution is dot, dot, dot,

because everyone always does the opposite of their New Year's resolutions,

mine is to work less and party more.

And I thought, that's a good one.

You know, people get that, the fact you always do the opposite.

So it means I'm going to be – have a very productive year.

And then I looked at the newspaper on New Year's Day and it said,

Chris Brown, New Year's resolution.

Work less, party more.

And that was all it said.

I was like, yeah, right.

Okay.

So I'm the party guy of the Sydney scene and that's fine.

That's all right.

I think it raised a few eyebrows with the network, but that's –

And sometimes humor doesn't translate, does it?

Things are a lot more literal now than they once were.

It would have thought that there might have been, you know,

a laughing – probably pre-emoji, wasn't it, in those –

Yeah, correct.

In those times.

Hey, Chris, we feel –

I feel really, you know, grateful that you've joined a space

that I'm really passionate about, a world we call Alita Connect.

And we love bringing people together from different backgrounds

to share and connect and learn.

I've spoken about it a lot in this forum.

And I love the group you're involved in.

I know they're private spaces, but I spoke to you about comfortable

enough to share the group.

And if I could go through them for a start, it's yourself,

Benjamin Northey, who I had the great privilege of talking

to on this podcast.

What an incredible creator.

Creative, brilliant genius.

The conductor of the Melbourne Symphony Orchestra

and one of the most revered conductors around the world,

Ben Northey, an Australian legend in his space.

Richard Oppie.

An insightful guy, Ben.

He is remarkable.

He can just floor us with an observation in an instant.

He's amazing.

I might get you to share some reflections on it all.

Richard Oppie maybe has the biggest marketing job in the world, Rich.

He's the global head of brands for Budweiser, AB InBev,

for those that aren't aware.

I think the biggest consumer goods brand in the world.

And so Rich has an incredible success story in the world of marketing

and what they do at that level.

Michael Voss, AFL legend, doing a brilliant job as coach of cart.

One of the great leaders in our era, Chris, just an incredible person,

Michael Voss, and fantastic at what he does.

Trent Robinson, likewise.

I know you had some history with Trent before, but legend of his space

with the Sydney Roosters and the NRL.

And Dr. Chris Brown.

It's an interesting.

You know, a group getting together.

Can you tell us a bit about the experience?

It just has, you know, you think about that group of people and you already can tell

everyone's approaching things from a very, very different angle.

You have some real thought leaders in there and some real innovative thinkers.

And I just love, you know, we will bring a little problem into the mix there and a

little hurdle as they're called.

And.

And.

It'll just bounce around between the group and everyone will put their own little take, take on it.

And then someone from nowhere will just come in with some sort of insightful statement around an experience they've had or a message that they've used at a particular time.

And everyone just sits back and goes, whoa, like, what was that?

That is, that's amazing.

And everyone's sort of scribbling it down and writing it down.

And it, there's, it's so equal.

Everyone, everyone contributes.

It's in their own unique ways.

And, you know, there are, there are weeks where, you know, the, the old imposter syndrome is very easy to kick in when you're surrounded by the experience and, and the, and sort of the leadership qualities of these people.

But everyone, everyone finds their space and everyone finds their, their ability to, to, to really add, add value.

And, and there've been some, you know, you, you let into these, into these leaders worlds and it's fascinating to hear.

What's, what's actually going on behind the scenes there.

You know, Rich, Rich Oppie, you know, so, so high up in, in, in Anheuser-Busch brewing and, and, and what he does there and, and, you know, he's just been at the World Cup and, and obviously there's been a lot of news around, around the, the serving of beer at the World Cup and, and to be able to, to sort of hear how that all, that all works out and, and how they, they manage the communications around that is, is, that's, that's fascinating.

Fascinating, fascinating world and fascinating insight.

And, you know, the world of marketing that he, he, he comes from is, is very different to the world of sport or, or the world of, of orchestral music and collaboration in that, in that respect, or, or the world of, of animals.

And, and then, you know, I try to add, add some value from my experience working in, in teams of, of, of people trying to, you know, wrangle giraffe on the fields of, of Botswana.

Like it's, it's.

Can I ask?

That question, I don't, I'm, you've, you've opened that, that door and I, if you, I know these conversations are private, but I find this incredible, isn't it?

And I, and I was told that you, you shared a story of, cause you do volunteer in Africa and, and, and get involved, but you literally, you know, how do, how do you tackle a giraffe and, and tell us that story.

So I've always found it interesting in my, in my field.

I don't really have mentors.

Like I don't really have strict.

Sort of role models, but because there aren't really people who do what I do, where you straddle this, this world of veterinary science and, and media and, and sort of creativity.

And, and it's so the, the closest thing I could find to, to a creative thought leader in the world of animals is this, this guy called Pete Morkle and he's a Namibian wildlife vet, which is Nietzsche already.

But this guy, this guy walks with a limp.

He's got one ear, he's had, had his legs broken, I think about seven times.

He's been kidnapped three times.

He, he looks like he should be in a movie that his character should be portrayed by like Clint Eastwood in, in his sort of defining role of his career.

He's just an icon of African wildlife because there's, there's no animal he'll say no to.

And he's kind of, he's kind of the vet for, you know, you, your local vet is your vet for your suburb.

This guy's a vet for Africa.

And he.

He, he works with, with lions one day, he'll work with giraffe the next, rhinos, he's been charged by, you know, rhinos about, about seven times, nearly killed by about three rhinos.

He's just got the roll call of like the coolest scars in the world.

And, and I met him at a function in, in Sydney about, about 10 years ago.

And, and he's, you know, he's got a pretty good sense of humor and he's like, he goes, you know, you, you look like you're, you know, you, you seem like you're all right as a vet.

Yeah.

I reckon we need to toughen you up a bit.

And I was like, right.

Then he started to tell me these stories about getting kidnapped in Chad and, and ransoms being paid.

And, and I thought, Jesus, okay, this is, this is probably a little step up from, from your local Bondi, Bondi Veterinary Hospital treating, you know, seven poodles in a day.

And, and so we, we kept in touch and he was like, he was like, look, it suggests these trips and I'd always be working.

And then finally this, this trip came up and, and we went across and.

We went across to, to, to wrangle some some giraffe.

And so the, the giraffe that it's been moved, essentially there was going to be a mine built in this giraffe, this prized giraffe habitat.

And so we had to move the giraffe across the Nile river.

And that's not as simple as sort of opening a gate and, and sort of shooing them through these wild giraffe.

And giraffe.

delicate at the best of times tricky to to manage and so i got over there and had to learn the

finer points of how you how you sedate and and move uh giraffe and and basically what you do

if anyone wants to try this at home this is what you do this is your guide to how to catch it

you're riding this thing um so you get a tranquilizer dart not readily accessible

sure but you get a tranquilizer dart and you dart the giraffe but that's that's just the start

because the giraffe then runs and and the the tranquilizer will put them to sleep but it has

this period of excitation so it's a stimulant for about a minute and so they take off and they run

and they run themselves almost to the point of death and so you have to once you dart them you

have to take off in these four-wheel drives these sort of jeeps across

the african savannah and they're fast are they giraffe so fast yeah yeah so fast and and they'll

just go wherever wherever the spirits take them and one time one of them ran into the nile river

and everyone just looked at me and said well mate you're that you're the guy from from the beach you

jump in the water so i'm in the crocodile infested nile river trying to like keep this giraffe's head

up while they sort of attach ropes and and tow the giraffe out of the nile that was one that was

one situation but the rest of the time they'll sort of run themselves and they'll they'll

start to slow down but you have to get them on the ground quickly because they've built up so much

lactic acid um and it's in so much oxygen debt from this run that they will die they essentially

they essentially have a heart attack so you have to get them on the ground and so they then teach

you to get this really long rope it looks like a massive skipping rope and you need eight people

four on each end of this rope and you run in front of this giraffe and because they're quite

sedated by this

stage and stumbling and exhausted you have to use this rope to trip the giraffe over and so it's

still it's still sort of it's jogging by this stage not sprinting jogging and so you run around

in front of it and and try to trip it over and you it usually takes three or four goes but the

emphasis is on getting this giraffe on the ground quickly the moment you trip it over someone has to

jump on the giraffe's head um because once you're on their head they can't stand up because that's

the pendulum that's

a belief that allows them to sort of swing upwards and and stand up so someone goes on the head and

then this was my job someone has to jump on onto their neck and inject about five mils of this

reversal agent of this of this sedation to essentially save their life wow um and and

allow their heart to sort of pump normally again and get rid of all this this lactic acid and then

so that was my job and then there's people on legs there there are people on on the body but

the head is kind of your lifeline if he moves you're you're gone um and and then you you wake

this giraffe up and with a blindfold on and the rope that the big skipping rope and you steer it

um essentially using the rope and pressure on each end of the rope onto a horse float

um and the giraffe is fully awake by this stage but blindfolded and then you get into a horse

float and then you drive it uh across the Nile River um that is how you catch a giraffe well

but it's what a life lesson what a life lesson and it's the ultimate sort of uh collaborative

moment isn't it I suppose if the guy on the head is having an off day hasn't listened that well

you're in some serious danger and as all animal lovers too I mean the worst scenario for you guys

would be that you didn't get it right and the giraffe died too so yeah it's yeah intense

that is

that is

that is

the nature of it that that um you know to borrow my my dad's amazingly comforting and and and

conciliatory message when you've got livestock you've got dead stock um and and and sadly you

know with with wildlife they're prone to stress and and if you can't catch that giraffe in time

um you if it runs away or gets you know becomes lost in in bushland that they they will usually

die um because of the amount of lactic acid they've they've built up they're they're kind of

like darts at the um the first sort of five

k time trial of the season um they just blow up they blow up pretty hard and nearly close

and yeah and that's that's that's obviously heartbreaking for everyone because you're there

to help them and um you know we we moved 20 20 giraffe in that time and and and pretty much got

every single member of that that group away from what was going to be a a mine site and a danger

zone for for poachers and and um and some wildlife track trafficking essentially so

yeah but but as you say that that vet that I mentioned at the start there Pete Morkle he

leads this team and and sort of assigns you to your sub team um but he's amazing guy in the way

that you can bring together english speakers non-english speakers people of varying degrees

of experience um tribal groups um from these areas that that were warring with each other

um you know not you know they had they had basically ethnic cleansing um you know not

so it's um it's a remarkably sort of difficult process but but one that that has you know

remarkable uh remarkable results if if you get it right and and you know that that's that's sort of

the nature of that that part of Uganda which is where we were doing the work is is um a very

vibrant place but but also um you know has its challenges and Chris that's what I love about you

know someone like you is uh as you said in a unique space creativity and uh doing the veterinary work

and it's not something that there is many mentors available but uh you know for you to you know to

share that experience and share that leadership and as you said um you know with uh someone who's

marketing beer on a global scale someone who's conducting an orchestra a couple of sporting uh

legends it's fascinating share of life experience and it feels like we've come out of this sort of

hyper individualized time in the world where everyone's a bit focused on self to a bit of

a crisis of connection so again it's a you know it's a really uh fascinating thing and we appreciate

joining that space and if you are interested I will give a short plug uh a leader is the space

we're in you don't have to be a superstar tv uh most loved uh tv vet like Chris Brown to join us

you can um you know be in education or running a small business a leader collective.com check it

out thanks again Chris for being so open uh to be involved in it no no pleasure and I think um

I think what I've I've really found interesting is is that I think through vulnerability in those

spaces it comes the greatest the greatest results and and being I guess not not being arrogant enough

to think that you you don't have challenges that you face um and and in a collaborative space like

that to to be humble enough to go you know this is this is something I'm I'm challenged by or I'm

having difficulty with in my particular sphere this week or over the last month what do you guys

reckon what would be a good work around for for this little challenge or how can I bring the best

um and even just articulating that you'll often make sense of it more in your own mind as well

but but to have the gift of these different viewpoints um has been has been such a blessing

and and and such a I guess an enriching influence on on my my life to be able to to lean on those

on those learnings in in everyday life and and I guess be a better um you'd be a better

leader and be a better team member when when you do step into other stressful situations or or

unexpected situations which you know uh I think we're all we're all exposed to it at different

times and and just to have that have that little have that little nugget in in your uh in your

kit bag you can pull out and think you know what that that might just get me through that situation

and I love your commitment to it Chris I understand you you've been in Iceland and Finland and three

o'clock in the morning in the back of the combi van there's uh there's Dr Chris Brown dialing in

to to connect and collaborate it's a it's a great effort um in the middle of the night you must have

been getting some strange looks from the the locals in that part of the world my like already

when you um when you're sort of a six foot five sort of Australian driving around in a camper van

um you already get you already get some strange looks but you know me me sitting the little glow

of my laptop um in these sort of isolated campsites while everyone's you know a lot of people

are over the age of sort of 75 um

who are who are on these camper van adventures and and there's me sort of tapping in and and and

chatting with the with the guys uh in the in that group but I I wouldn't I wouldn't miss a session

for the world I I just think they're um they're so uh they're so enriching and so and so interesting

and you get off you get off those those calls feeling like a like a better person and and and

with those sort of mentors and with those um those those guys who who whose problems aren't and

challenges I guess aren't aren't that different to your own they're just in a in a different

context and uh Chris it's you know fascinating for you to you know I love how you you're open to

uh as you said all of us have challenging moments I think from the outside you know

people look at Chris Brown and think wow you know that's the life I'd love to have surfing

down at Bondi uh incredible life traveling around the world surfing the best uh breaks

and you know being on TV and life seems like it's perfect but I mean I'm assuming yeah everyone has

their challenges don't they have their bumps is you you're open to share has there been a regret

um or a fail you could share because it does look like you've got the perfect life Chris but I

suppose that doesn't exist no I think um no you know far from it I I think uh yeah I I can be my

my harshest critic uh often um which which I think is is a is a useful skill but also one that you you

need to keep an eye on because uh you probably you're probably doing okay but but you're um

you're in a critic can can sometimes have the

loudest voice in the room and I think that's something to be always to be to be mindful of

um look I once got I once got told by a television executive um that I'm a difficult dog to keep on

the porch and I appreciated that the animal animal sort of linked to to the to the analogy

um but what what he was trying to say was probably something that is quite relevant I I get bored

easily um and I'm always looking for a new challenge and it's kind of that that situation

where curiosity is a really useful thing to have and it's sort of guided me through a lot of what

I've done because I'm I want to I want to learn more and I want to be better um but but it can

mean that you you I never like to be stuck in one thing for too long and and always want to be want

to be moving on and trying trying something else um so that's that's potentially a a bit of a

challenge I'm I'm I I do find it hard to be to stay in one place for for too long which is I'd

has you know flow and effects to you know to relationships i i probably would have thought

that i i'd probably have have kids and and um you know potentially be be married uh by now and and

uh but that you know that hasn't happened because i probably prioritized work a little bit um

potentially in hindsight a little bit too much but but that that sort of things

barks quite loudly you know to use another animal analogy um it's it can be quite a demanding

a demanding thing to to focus on on work so if you know there is there are probably any regrets

i have it's it's probably around not necessarily having enough enough time for for uh for myself

and and for the people the people around me funnily enough in iceland i i had this really

profound moment i was hiking in the highlands of iceland and and deliberately i was there by

myself and i just was hiking and just

going going up and down these these little these volcanoes basically and uh i was just

sort of pondering pondering life and it's a great place to do that because the natural

beauty of things there is is just off off the charts and and it just kind of is a really

interesting reminder the fact that when you are driven and when you're when you're determined to

always um strive to be better and and curiosity leads you on those paths and and you you invest in

the you know creating a show or doing a working on a production and and you know it's such a

privilege to be the front and center of those productions something like i'm a celebrity get

me out he has has 400 crew and you have the honor of standing in front of the camera essentially

presenting the work of 400 people um it's it's a reminder that you come sometimes get obsessed with

the climb and the climb up that mountain and taking on a show and working a show is like

at a base camp if you like you fuel yourself up you get yourself whole you feel like you're ready

to take on a challenge you store up all that adrenaline you're ready to go and you start the

climb and and creating a show is a lot like that um and and you you take the hits it's hard at

different times but you want to get to the peak of that mountain which which is essentially your

rating success it's it's a it's a show that's well received it's your performance is is something

that is is well regarded and and

and you you um you reach those heights and and you come off air in that that final episode of

the series and you're like done what a great high and then and then you kind of look around from the

top of that mountain and and realize there's there's about 50 or 60 other mountains um out

in the distance that they're also they're as high if not higher than the one you you're on so you

think okay i'll go back down this mountain and go back to my base camp and then you sort of refuel

in and and you realize that everyone in life everyone's climbing mountains you know in their

different fields and uh but but it's kind of the climb's not important the the view from the top's

not important it's kind of like it's basically what happens in the base camp is is kind of the

most important part of of life and i think that's probably i probably neglect my my base camp a

little bit uh too much and and the nurturing sort of refueling um fulfilling aspects of of that i

think it probably

um probably something that uh that you know i i probably would look to spend more time

uh working on and and i know i'm not alone in that in that respect in in terms of being able to

switch off and and uh and i guess re-engage with the world around you that's not as adrenaline

fueled or cortisol fueled as that that world and i'm sure sports people who who get themselves

up for a season it's that's that's their mountain they're climbing

um it's it's it's fair it's fairly relevant across a lot of people and and so that's kind

of been a really interesting lesson uh for me and something which we talk about in the elit uh

collective group a lot is is just that how do we how do we switch off and how do we refuel and how

do we reconnect and i think that's been a really interesting one to to to see how shared that that

challenge is of of switching off and of re recharging that's that's probably that's probably

the biggest the biggest one that um that i think is is it is an ongoing challenge for so many of us

in doing some preparation for this chris you know get on and do some research and

it seems to be an extraordinary fascination chris with uh your uh status in terms of you know one

story was which i wanted to you know the fact you broke your arm on a dance floor was a story i

thought you might have told at some stage the other story was like you've been apparently been married

eight times from what i read in in uh in preparation chris so maybe someone just has to tell you

i've been married at times and and i've i've had five i've i've been my partner's been pregnant

with five different children i haven't seen one of them um so i'm waiting for the knock on the door

but but according to new idea the knock will come at some stage i'm quite sure but yeah that that

that sort of interest in in my personal life it has always been kind of intriguing and you know

a few a few quite a few people tell me it's because i am private that they that they're interested in

and but i've just never been someone who's been who's enjoyed um sharing sharing that side of

things it's even before media i was i was always quite private around that that side of things and

um so i've always found the interest quite quite odd um and you know being followed by paparazzi

who are trying to get the shot of the my my new wife or new you know mother-to-be um i find it

i find it quite odd but but quite it's quite unnerving as well and and and it's it's sort of a

strange thing to have that that camera pointed at you and and uh yeah but but it's it's a hard thing

to to explain that that feeling that you get from it um but it's it is part and parcel of of the job

and you just have to accept the fact that it is you know we in a weird way it is a compliment that

that seemingly people want to know um even though i don't necessarily love to love to share um

people kind of want to know but

uh you know one year when i was i was in africa i had an african wedding um apparently and but

the magazine had photoshopped these photos they had the menu they had the guest list they even

had a wedding photo taken from behind and they'd photoshopped the back of my head and the back of

my partner's head um her her head and and dress and they had a full description of the wedding

i had family members like cousins contacting me saying pissed off thanks for the invite yeah

and the fact that they would invite us to the wedding and chris i suppose that's you know we

can laugh about you know that i i couldn't imagine walking your shoes in that experience but it it's

it's it's your mum who calls or the cousins who read it as fact isn't it that's where

the time is spent isn't it trying to tell people no that that hasn't happened is is that a common

occurrence for you and and do you just accept that yeah you you do you do and i think the

you always take comfort in the fact that the people the people closest to you do know

um exactly what's um what's the you know what's actually going on in your life but it is hard when

you know you get those messages or or people uh contact you and a little a little bit put out

about the fact that you're not they're not seemingly part of your life because they

haven't told you that you you've fathered three separate children to three different women in the

last year um so it's it's it's it's an it's odd it's odd but you you've got to at some point you

just got to laugh and just think you know wow it's going to be a it's going to be a good scrapbook

collection to to show that the kids one day well i was overwhelmed by the stories in uh in in doing

some homework uh chris wasn't quite aware of the of the extent of the of the courage when asking

these uh dimensions of leadership chris which we see a common we think in in a new form of leader

like yourself who are very much open to to learning and improvement and collaborating as you clearly

are with your sense of self-leadership chris does that does that term mean something to you being

a self-leader yeah i i think so i think it's it's it's all about um you know i try to stay

very current and very you know up to up to speed with with these worlds that i i operate in and try

to you know keep across popular culture and and um but also that the world of of animals and and

you know challenge myself

in that self-leadership style to to read um and and to uh to engage with um with different things

around me to to constantly keep keep relevant and and stay up to date because god the world of

animals the world of media it moves fast and you never really want to get um never really want to

get caught behind uh in in that world and so you know i get these i get these journals delivered to

house um you know every every week uh which ironically that the one that i get the most

is the journal of veterinary behavior and it's the one that my dog chews up the most um you know

trying trying to get some learnings for himself out of it um and just reminding me that you know

what do they say about you know dentists always have the worst teeth um and uh and you know the

vet's dog is always the worst behaved one and you know i'm a rescue dog and he's

constantly apologizing uh for him in in the dog park uh and and so it's yeah i think just holding

holding yourself to account to be current and relevant and and i guess it's also what makes

life interesting what's make what makes you feel interesting is to constantly be innovating and

and and challenging the the status quo and that's what i've i guess i've tried to do through my

whole whole career is is be a little bit different and and push the push the envelope just that little

bit um just just to to surprise you know it you never want to be boring i think it's it's a good

life mantra to never be boring or always challenging the norm and and um and and just

giving people something a little bit surprising i don't think you're ever going to be accused of

being uh boring chris anytime uh soon we see another dimension is losing really conscious

of how they positively impact others in their environment you know people you know won't know

when you know i'm a celebrity goes to air that there are 400 people behind

that and and you know tv is a small industry and you know you know lots of people have worked on

that show with you and they their comment is that it's just you know you're you create an environment

where it is a really positive uh environment for everyone that works on the show can you tell us

about maybe not that specific example but you can if you like around how you've gone about that

positive impact on others look i think um i think a lot of it has to do with um

you know obviously doing your job well that that's that's that's why you're there

um and in in my roles and responsibilities i feel like you know hosting and doing

doing honor to to the hard work of editors and producers and and the you know the celebrities

that are stuck in the jungle eating you know impala anuses um you know everyone's everyone's

putting in for the team dust um and and so i kind of get the the easy job of um of bringing that all

together um but i think these are so um i'm not sure uh i'd like to say i think as a leader

i've always been a big believer in the fact that so much of what we bring as a leader is is unspoken

and uh i think animals are such a great great example of this um in the way that you know

your dog doesn't understand much english if any at all um especially not mine in the dog park

um and and so

um and and so

we carry ourselves and and your body language and that unspoken language you know i've heard

it described as being half of you know up up to and sometimes more than half of our communication

is unspoken and it is that the energy you bring into a room um and it's it's it's you know people

talk about your aura or your your vibe or your charisma or your energy it's it's sort of that

that i guess that composure you can bring into a situation that makes that lets everyone know

it's it's everything's going to be okay but more than everything's going to be okay

that encouraging positive energy to contribute and asking people to bring

a little bit of themselves out as well and in a creative environment and really every

every work environment every sporting team has a creative element you you want to be

bringing ideas to the fore and doing things differently and so if you can bring calmness

if you can bring some real freedom to your writes with the things that you've been doing

bring positivity and through that that energy you bring encourage contributions and collaborations

i i think i think that's a huge a huge thing and that's before you even open your mouth

um you're already bringing a hell of a lot to the to the table and i think that's that's something

that i i really really relish on on those big productions is is the ability to um to be to be

a team player and to engage with different team members um in a really encouraging positive way

and make everyone feel like everyone's pushing in this in the same same direction and and we're all

we're all part of creating this incredible product at the end and that's that's something

that that you know i enjoy that show so much because of of that experience of having so many

people from so many different backgrounds working all sorts of crazy hours to bring this this kind

of

crazy kind of strange tv show to the to the fore but we we kind of love we kind of love that um

that whole process and enjoying just enjoying the process enjoying the privilege of of being in the

middle of africa um and and somehow uh you know calling what we do over there a job um is is kind

of a bit of an honor in a way and i love the way you describe that isn't it you know your energy

shows up before you speak doesn't it on on so many uh occasions and having you clearly think about

that it is a bit of an honor in a way and i love the way you describe that isn't it you know your

it impacts uh a team of that scale in an incredibly positive way um creating i think it's yeah yeah

it's just going to say it's you know we we get up at four in the morning and it's very easy to walk

in and be like oh i'm tired or yeah i'm really exhausted and then you sort of look around and

and the writers we use on that show um you know matt and michael these two guys who are incredibly

talented but they've been up since midnight like they've been in there since midnight so

there's always someone more tired than yourself and i think it's it's it's it's it's it's it's it's

always someone more stressed than yourself um and and there's always someone who's who's

questioning themselves you know more than you're questioning yourself like you you've got no reason

to to feel down it's it's all a privilege it's all upside really and and i think it it's it's

all privilege really to to to be there so yeah it's it's a really useful reminder to look around

your your team members and and appreciate the fact that you've you um you're you're in you're

in a good spot thing things are okay it's a it's a great way to articulate it

one of my favorite people in media to work with has been bruce mcavaney um over the journey for

exactly that reason it could be around 16 i always you just feel this incredible privilege

grew up wanting to play sport for a living and then to be there on a saturday sitting in the

best seat in the house calling the game in my view every day has to be a good day like that

is someone's best ever day but you can get you know the rain's coming down middle of winter it's

16 versus 17 you get a few crusty journos in the media box going what a crap day this is and and

you know terrible game you know i can't believe we're here for this one i often think you know

what else would you know we all be doing but but you walk into the the seven bot and there's bruce

and and and oh you're not gonna believe how exciting this is you should see this player

that i saw last week from freemantle he went to this school and it's just proper joy and it's

and you go he's been doing it longer than anyone if he's still able to bring that level of

enthusiasm that's something we should all uh have that perspective all the time

and it's infectious you you just immediately want to be good you know you can't help but

you know yeah rub off and and you realize that at different times that

everyone's everyone's job everyone's work everyone's sort of role throws up these these

sort of these bizarre situations every now and then and you you sort of have to have to appreciate

them and you know you know being able to uh you know to go toe-to-toe with someone like freddie

hoff who you know former english cricket art almost australia's cricketing nemesis of the of

the early 2000s and such a character but so quick with it and and and to measure yourself up against

these guys and and um and you're going to these mental mind games and you realize what makes

sports some of these sports people great isn't their physical attributes it's it's their mindset

and the ability to to to get inside that mind and the ability to to get inside that mindset

and see what makes them tick um and see what entertains them but see their methodical process

and and you know freddie was one who who before he went to a trial which are like these challenges

where you can they compete essentially to win food he would go around the group and get research

material on me and my life to be able to throw back at me in like who i was dating or or um what

i what i like what i didn't like anything to do with my history he'd research the group so he

had ammunition um to to bring into these trials so if it went if it went we went toe to toe he'd go

shot for shot and and fire back at me and so but he didn't realize i was able to watch the monitor

so i'm seeing him go around the group and before the trial getting all this information so i'd have

the the counter argument for everything he was going to put forward um and and so similar similar

thing with you know with warny um you know we miss him so much and and what i what i loved about him

in the jungle was it was it was a great example of of what made him so bloody great and it was that

just that meticulous thought process and the fact that he could he could will himself over

the line with with mindset alone and you know he he would have to it was one time where it's

it's so bizarre to even talk about but you know a fermented herring milkshake you know and it's

it's one of the most disgusting foods on the planet um and it's a delicacy in sweden but who

would have thought um and he it was just disgusting and he couldn't he couldn't get it down and so i

thought i'm going to get one over warning here i thought if warning can't do it then if i can get

if i can do something warning can't then this he'll he'll hate it but but it'll also we'll also

love it because we'll always have that over and uh and i went and thought i'll show warning and and

what he knew best this thing was horrendous and i vomited on the set you know about 10 seconds later

and just kept on vomiting for about an hour after that and uh and when you know what he was right

and he never forgot that and every single time i saw him after that he'd bring it up but um the

the ability of his mind to mind over matter to be able to create a thought process that would allow

him to win against the odds um was was incredible to see and and and that little insight into into

mind of great leaders and great performers um is something that i i really i really treasure out

of those out of those different moments unique window into the genius isn't it that was a guy

who ate you know toasted cheese sandwiches and and baked beans only so he was in very uncomfortable

uh territory and and as you have and anyone that had the pleasure of being around you know shane

the the most generous and and collaborative and bring people together and you know he was

unbelievable on that show

understand with a couple of disclaimers uh chris which may be a story for another time but there

was a certain things that he needed uh uh wanted to get through that um you know you may or may

not be able to confirm i just i'm gonna leave that smile on on your face and just the nods

um creating and sharing a vision is something we see leaves are really

good at these days and conscious of you know doing the homework and looking at what you're

doing with drool you know the integrity quality ingredients in the pet food industry i mean

there's a lot of things that you do that are are unique how have you gone about that creating

and sharing that vision yeah look business has always felt like a a very foreign thing to me i

think if you were to sort of look inside the brain of most vets that sort of the the animal

capabilities takes up sort of 99 of it and then in one little dark deep dark corner is is the

business mind and it's it's sort of suppressed because there are no good vets who are businessmen

aware and um and and so but but this desire to make a difference that i i that kind of guides me

through everything i do to do things differently and and and make a difference um i just for years

and years i've i just sit in a vet clinic and look at at the the foods and the products that that we

feed our pets and it's it's it's terrible there's there's no regulation there's no proper regulation

and you can kind of just you know bung a label on on any old thing that you you it can be unfit for

human consumption but it's fine it's fine for animals um and and i just got so sick of seeing

these products claiming to be able to help and claiming to do this and that and there'd be no

scientific basis to it whatsoever and and um and just thought i'd go in there and shake

shake things up a little bit with my own brand that actually you know did have the research

behind it and did have the quality behind it and um didn't know what i was getting myself into

um launching a business and and it takes up way more time way more sort of after hours time than

ever i ever thought but but drool is is sort of my expression of um yeah just just this passion to

to help out animals and and address the the biggest challenges that our pets face um

whether it's anxiety or whether it's joint problems or or um you know whether it's dental

health or all those gut upsets all those different challenges just by being able to help them through

through proper proper nutrition

um nutrition and supplements that actually do do help you know perish the thought it's um it's

great and uh you know dust i'm sure those knees are a little dusty um by this stage you can i can

i can hook you up and and you know work i'm sure it works for people as well we can talk

that's uh that's another angle i hadn't thought of that with uh we're looking at the ingredients

but the knees are in trouble so i might uh i might take you up on that i've heard you use

the word curiosity a lot in this conversation already about being incredibly curious which we

see is another common dimension and trait tell us about you know using curiosity for for your

approach to learning and development yeah it's um i guess i don't like the conventional i i i think

there's there's excitement and there's brilliance in in new ideas and i'm always naturally drawn to

the to the new ideas and and the new ways of uh of doing things and and always trying to find i guess

a better way of of of doing whatever whatever you're doing and and you know that from from

the outset that was always uh that was always something that i was i was keen to do and you

know i remember you know finally yvette while everyone was sort of buttering up the the

lecturers to give them good marks and and teach them you know the conventional way of doing

surgery i was trying to do come up with different ways of of doing surgery whilst going off to film

parody videos that mocked the very lecturers i was trying to i was trying to get get information

from which is probably a slightly counterproductive um counterproductive tool and mechanism but but

that desire to sort of entertain and and be creative in what i did was was always um

was always there and and then when i graduated i i uh i i learned i learned surgery um

not in the conventional way like i you know most most people sort of do dog and

spays and and castrations and and i did those but i had a client down the road from my very first

vet practice in neutral bay and he had he had pet mice and and mice uh they're funny little they're

miss they're misjudged pets i i don't think people see them as being cuddly beautiful little creatures

but they're quite funny little little animals and but his mice used to always get these tumors and

and and so

i um i would go and uh he'd bring these these mice in almost every week with a with a tumor and he

had about 20 of them so they're always getting these lumps and so i i learned surgical skills by

performing surgery on mice and and that was sort of my curious mind of like every other every other

vet in the area was saying no just put it down and i was like no i reckon there's a chance here i

reckon we can do something do something and i i worked out a way to operate on mice using these

tiny little instruments

and uh and and got quite good at removing tumors um these tumorous growths these cancerous growths

from from mice and and so when it came to operating on dogs and cats or cows or horses that was easy

like that that was gotta be pretty delicate i'm assuming operating on them i'm sure there's a

margin for error is there with a with a nice thing if if they lose you know a mill of blood

during the operation it's um it's a meal too much they they they'll they won't wake up and they're

gonna have to do another surgery and then they're going to have to go back out from the surgery so

um that that kind of became a bit of a bit of fun and and and develop those those skills and and

then yeah that curiosity to learn more about different animals and and the way different

animals worked meant that while a lot of the other vets again would say no to a bird um to

looking after a bird or to looking after a guinea pig or to looking after a you know a kangaroo joey

that someone had been out in the country and found on a country road and decided to bring back to the

city for no for no apparent reason and so i just developed this name i guess around the local area

for kind of looking after a bit of everything and and i kind of like that that to me is the

best demonstration of what a vet can be is is someone who who just looks after the entire

breadth of the animal kingdom um and and so because of that you know one thing led to

another and ended up doing the show bondi vet and then in bondi vet i used to look after lots of

different lots of different animals and then um a few years ago uh i got a i got contacted by this

production company in the us and they they wanted me to to front this show called vet gone wild

right and and like the name suggests it was um it was basically the role was as a vet who went into

any

country in the world and treated any animal they came across in any situation and it sounds very

exciting until you realize just how bloody daunting that is um and so i signed up for the

show it was with animal planet in the us and it was a big you know big big job and i was pretty

pretty excited about it and it was a different country every week so you you land in in uh i

think namibia was the first country you went to and i looked after cheetahs and i've done some

i've done lion surgery before

so cheetahs were fine but we're doing surgeries on cheetahs um then we went out to uh to look after

some elephants and and yeah that's i had a awkward situation where i had to give a contraceptive

injection to an elephant a few years before and the biggest biggest danger when you when you when

you dart an elephant is you want them to when they fall asleep they don't run off like the giraffe when

you want them when they fall asleep to fall asleep on their side because then you can stretch their

trunk out because if they fall asleep on their trunk um that's like falling asleep on how they

breathe and and so they they can suffocate but if you if you dart a male if they fall asleep

in the dog basically like a dog sits in the same the same sort of dog sitting position

um they sit on their penis and and they cut off the they they can essentially

the look on your face says it all does but you know you're talking about a couple of tons going

through their their penis and and it can be catastrophic understandably and so the the one

time i darted an elephant before he'd sat on his penis and so you have to run in with a couple of

people and push this elephant over and free free his his old mate and and otherwise you know he'll

net he'll never breed again um so i at least brought some experience um of the strangest kind

into working with elephants um on this show and so different country every week but we went to

vietnam we obviously did australia uh namibia south africa but the craziest one we ended up in costa

rica and and this is kind of where where curiosity can can really get the better of you and and can

can really do a job on you sometimes and so we're driving through the mountains of costa rica and we

get this phone call from this local wildlife rescue group who were excited about the fact they had a

they had a

vet on hand um and they said oh uh and this is most of this is in spanish and my spanish isn't

very good and but i i could hear the word sloth getting getting mentioned and so we went out to

this um this little farmhouse out in the rainforest and and that that had this that that spotted a

sloth in a tree nearby that had this arm that was hanging down and so we had to shake this tree with

a blanket underneath it to to shake this tree with a blanket underneath it to to shake this tree and

to shake this sloth out of the tree sloth fell it falls down onto the blanket and i'm i'm leading

this at this stage a team of of 10 10 television crew uh from this us production um plus this sort

of wildlife rescue team of about five people in broken spanish and i'm presented with a sloth

with a with a badly injured arm and it at that point it dawns on me that i've never i've never

seen a sloth before

never like not even in a zoo i've never seen a sloth before and i mean i'm dealing with a

foreign language and and i had to work out a way to uh to to treat this sloth and we worked out

i've worked out very quickly that um all the hair on the the slot's arm was was burnt and and sadly

this sloth had been climbing through the vines in this rainforest and someone had run an illegal um

electrical wire through the through the rainforest and he'd zap his arm on this on this electrical

wire and and you know it was at this moment that i i was grateful that i'd worked with with this

crazy namibian vet pete morkel this guy that i was telling you about because he always said you know

never get never get overroared by the animal that you that you have in front of you because you've

always got your your first principles you've always if you don't get fooled by the animal

you're looking at almost every animal works the same way the the infection pro infection

process works the same way inflammation works the same way um and and the way you stabilize an

animal the way you mend an animal is is all is all basically the same apart from a sloth

slots slots are quite different you know every pretty much every animal on earth has seven

vertebrae in their neck um sloths either have five or six depending on the species like they're just

different like everything's different um and very slow and so i was just sitting there going what am

this rolling on everything and the americans love the drama and and they're hyping up the fact that

this is going to be you know this is the toughest case this guy's ever ever faced and i just needed

a moment like i i just so i i i had i used a trick i used to use when i was when i was um

when i first graduated and i didn't know the answer to something i'd never leave i'd always

leave my thermometer in in the suburban vet clinic i'd always leave my thermometer out of the room

say to the client i just need to go and grab the thermometer and that would give me thinking time

and so i just told these guys i'm really busting to go to the bathroom in costa rica so i bugger off

try to find this toilet find a toilet or a tree and so i just get on my phone i start googling

um thankfully there was reception so i started googling how to look after a sloth i'm like drug

dosages for a sloth because i knew basically you know the the nabibian vet pete is right the

nabibians the cows are the same we had infection we had inflammation stabilize that give fluids

get this sloth back to good health and then work out a plan from there just buy yourself some time

but i needed to know what drugs we could use on this this sloth and so i i i started googling

you know drug dosages for any inflammatories and antibiotics for sloths and thank god some

a wildlife vet in the us who had had a few in a zoo had written a research paper and i found this

what use the drug dosages he used um so you know dr google got me out of a lot of trouble

and and once we stabilize this sloth um you know the vital signs start to improve

ransom fluids through this sloth and and intravenously and and the sloth starts to

look a bit brighter um and and by the end of the day i ended up in surgery um in a in a local

in a local uh in a local vet hospital um that we borrowed the facilities of and and i performed um

you know one of the very few leg amputations of a sloth that i as far as i know that had ever been

performed and uh and it was a great example of of how to approach a really challenging problem

and a really what might be a very overwhelming problem and and by breaking it down to little

into little parts and and understanding the fact that you

you do actually know how to solve this problem even though it's a sloth and not a dog

the the same the same approach is is is there and and using those sort of fine surgical skills that

i learned through operating on mice um you're able to bring all these different strands

of curiosity and and allow them to pay off in in one very neat little moment of performing a limb

amputation on a sloth in costa rica and and you you think wow that how did i get

here but but it's all been because of of a i guess a fairly curious mindset um through life

but that enables you to be able to to even be in that situation and then then be able to get

through it that's a high pressure thing with a film crew of 10 filming live uh you know that's

um i'm assuming on a plane when someone yells out if there's a doctor uh you're on there's

no hiding there um you need to put your hand up but that's uh that's a whole new level i like

halfway through that answer your cat uh jumped uh onto you

a lap and um and a lot of very comfortably um dispensed with the cat in the kindest possible

way i think there was a brazilian soccer coach who found himself in a lot of trouble where the

world cup i'm not sure if you saw that but uh there was a random cat i saw at a press conference

here he's back again the cat um that's when you she she's she's got an ability to um the moment

i'm involved in in anything to uh to she starts tapping tapping on keys on the keyboard to see

which one you know makes a sound and and and and and and and and and and and and and and and and

and which one turns the screen off which one disconnects the entire the entire recording so

that that was the next step that's why that's why she um she gets politely sort of moved that is a

beautiful looking uh cat because you've got rescue dog cat is that the end of the uh the home yeah

yeah i uh i do spend a lot of time away and and so there are only so many favors you can call upon

from um from neighbors and and friends and yeah you've got you've got to

you've got to draw the line because working around animals you have plenty of options to

to adopt and you either have one or you have a hundred um and so it's uh it's tricky but but

yeah you can't you can't adopt them all basically uh chris we see uh but communicating with clarity

is a is a concept that is 21st century style of leaders who we really admire are very uh astute

and it's become your um your life in lots of ways

the way that you communicate you've got a great art at doing it is it is it something that

you've consciously thought about how you communicate yeah it is i think um i think when

you when you have a a mind that's busy and always thinking um the the biggest challenge i guess is

refining all those different ideas um into a into a steady accessible stream of consciousness um

and

i've i've tried

to over the years reduce just how much i try to communicate in in any one moment uh and very

early on in in tv i there used to be a saying that you know one problem one solution in any story

don't don't don't give you know three different problems and seven different solutions because

people just you just lose you just lose people and i think communication has to be simple it

has to be accessible if it's going to be successful and um and so

for me i think just working out what what that what that key message is and but but i guess

delivering it in in an interesting engaging way you can you can talk as you can talk as much as

you like but unless i think unless you're presenting that with a little bit of sugar on top

and and something that makes that that little information nugget accessible and interesting

you kind of lose people and you know with it

i was reading some some incredible stuff around the attention span of of people nowadays and and

just how how quickly it's it's diminishing and you know it used to be sort of 12 12 seconds

which is which is still sounds remarkably short but but now it's down to sort of one or two or

two seconds and you've got to kind of grab them in amongst all of that in that time otherwise

you kind of lose them and constantly constantly be giving some sort of stimuli to to keep them

keep them together you know there's a lot of research around the fact you know phones and

social media responsible for that for the fact that there's there's so much entertainment on tap

so i i always feel like communication if you can do with some degree of entertainment

with it with a story attached or or or with something that that keeps them hooked through

and it's kind of a very tv or radio way of thinking to to hook them through but i think you

have to um in in

in terms of communication leave them hanging leave them wanting to know more rather than less

um and don't overwhelm them with with with information so um you know tease tease them

through but but but don't overwhelm essentially yeah it's a common uh theme i i hear a lot in

those interviews sir chris around you know the intelligence of condensing that information in

a way that uh simplifies something it's much more complex or as you just said then uh the attention

span uh

we know it's it's you know the tick-tock world is uh hard to compete with uh you know how quick

that captures the attention of the of the next generation for sure it's it's worrying it's it's

it's kind of a worrying thing but but you know you see you see yourself doing it i i find myself

um easily being being distracted with all the different different stimuli and and and just being

being comfortable with with the fact that one message is is better than trying to deliver five

and not landing a single one of them if you can get one message and one clear thought out out there

that's that's a win that's still that's still a successful uh moment of communication but if you

try to give them three or five you're going to lose them you're going to lose them um before

you even land one message it's a brilliant way to think about it for sure collaboration is something

we see leaders are really conscious of now as being something they seek a lot um how have you

approached collaboration

um yeah i i think it's something that that i uh i i enjoy when when you're surrounded by

like-minded people it's uh it's a very pleasurable uh it's a pleasurable situation to to to feel like

you're yeah you're you're i guess sharing and lessening that that sort of burden of responsibility

that placed wholly and solely on you but but also

you

i think it's it's a very narrow-minded approach to to think that you're the only carrier of of of ideas

um and and the ability to to seek out other other thoughts and and that diversity of thought i think

is is a really interesting is a really interesting idea and you never really know unless you unless

you ask um what you're what you're going to um to get out of people and and finding that language

to encourage people to to bring forward their ideas and their their thoughts and their their

take i think is um is is incredibly is incredibly useful you know you um you know you don't you don't

know what you don't know um it is a very simple statement but it but it is it is very true and

and you can you can go to some quite um special special places with with that collaboration and

and i think i think the best form of collaboration is challenge it's challenging um and and there's

a there's a mate of mine who i i collaborate with and i think it's it's it's it's it's it's it's it's

it's it's it's hard to to throw it into uh let's let's we can kind of talk about that for a few

moments in a finance aspect so um but but the the the the the same as what a gist of quite

the day when you're trying to promote youra the way you Мы often support you know the thing

that we the way that we're trying to lift from it's It's like we like it.

We've got

people from z OTânia on the internet all over.

We work on I'm on on tv and, and and show concepts and and he works executive producer of a few shows. The ABC guy called Chris Walker who he's a brilliant mind and I know what works in that collaborative sense is the fact that we were not we have we sat groundwells very early on where no and yeah I mean, yeah, apparently to give a perfect rule, we really are Paul Kirk and what I'm not, because the through without anyедиary effort. Mm hmm.

of thought was off limits.

And if you don't understand something, say it immediately.

And if you wanna know more,

or if you wanna question whether that's a good idea,

it's an open forum and we sort of set the ground rules

that we're okay with being upfront

with the fact we don't like that idea,

or that idea needs work, or that's not the strong one.

Being generous, being kind,

but at the same time being direct and not talking riddles

because you just waste so much time

trying to accommodate other people's thoughts

if you haven't established those ground rules

and you haven't been honest with each other.

And that language and that form of collaboration

is unique to any situation, any group.

And you can't take that sort of very open dialogue

into every situation.

You have to sort of have to read the room in a sense,

but that's one that works very well for us.

And enables us to take a core idea,

a core concept and build it into something

that is challengeable because ultimately though,

any idea you have in the real world,

it's gonna be challenged.

It's gonna encounter turbulence.

It's gonna have problems.

It's gonna have moments where you realize,

oh geez, does this actually work?

So you're better off troubleshooting that early on

and coming up with a solution and a plan.

Because the real world can sometimes be a cruel place

for new ideas and they can be shot down.

So stress testing those very early on,

I think is a very useful process.

And I love that you set the ground rules at the start

and make that work.

Who's been the greatest leader in your life?

Look, I think there wouldn't be one leader

strong, overarching leader that I think I look to

and think, you know what, if I can be just like them,

I'd be incredibly grateful.

But there are certainly a couple of people

that I borrow knowledge from and share knowledge with

and look to and respect.

And my old man, I grew up with him, as we said,

being the local vet and his ability to treat any,

any animal and not say no,

is something that I've obviously carried through.

And, you know, he did the world's first

beak transplant on a Pelican.

You know, had its beak shot off by a fisherman in the 80s.

And that's one of my earliest memories

is of Percy the Pelican with this,

he got a local surfboard manufacturer in Newcastle

to make an artificial beak using fiberglass,

same fiberglass they use on the surfboard.

surfboards and he got this guy to fashion a beak for this this pelican and then and then between

dad and myself we taught this pelican how to fish again using this fake beak um so that that has a

pretty profound impact um yeah someone like um and then then in the media in the media sense um

look someone i know you work with um closely someone like rob sitch is is is pretty

inspirational in terms of um you know quite a similar path where he went from being an emergency

human doctor um dealing in emergency rooms uh and and feeling kind of out of his depth in

emergency situations to to taking that that natural drama and translating it into drama on on

on television and and creating creating this this incredibly um timeless content when you think

you know programs like frontline or the the dish or the castle that those those very observational

um pieces of of work that that are that's truly stand the test of time um but that that combination

of science and creativity and process i really i really respect and and and he's a guy that i um

have a hell of a lot of time for and i've had the pleasure of working with on a few occasions um and

then um

yeah they say you should never meet your sort of idols or people you really respect and that's

probably no better demonstrator than than someone who i always respected a lot um was nelson mandela

um and i met nelson mandela one one time you met mandela i'd met mandela so i i i i'm already gonna

start sweating telling this story because i hate i hate it so much because of how it worked out but

i was at this is so odd but i was at vet school i was in um fourth year vet

and uh and on the campus at sydney university and this is at the time where john howard was

prime minister um and i think there'd been the tampa crisis um that there was a lot of unrest

around around treatment of refugees and john howard had decided he was going to give an honorary

doctorate to nelson mandela at sydney university on a on a november

day and at this stage i was i was meant to be in a lecture at vet school and i it was a beautiful

day and i was sitting here i thought you know what i'm going to skip this lecture um and uh and just

sat outside and just just did some other work and and was just to be honest probably a bit hung over

and just chatting with mates not planning to meet mandela at this stage not no no and and so the the

presentation to mandela was meant to happen at the great hall at sydney university but all these

protesters turned up to protest howard because because prime minister howard was going to be

there and uh and at the last minute they switched it from the prestigious great hall of sydney

university to for some inexplicable reason to the veterinary science conference center and at the

last minute so i'm sitting out i'm sitting outside this this lecture theater and all of a sudden

these

motorbikes and these the armor-plated vehicles start streaming into the vet school and i was

there i was there with two other mates who i was talking to and we look at each other and go what

is this what is going on and these guys get out of the vehicles you know talking to their wrists they

were clearly sort of a federal police or secret service style of operatives and we're like this

is interesting so we stood up and started walking over and out of the vehicle the one that sort of

makes it even more interesting is that they parked in front of a truck and they were very

stressed or scared or they weren't finally getting out please don't worry that's a common lie

well and they uh some of my friends like pohang was born in

america these guys and one of my Clark上andla hip Mao was born in Ankara and they at that time

had one of the most expensive stretchers on board which was a any size car as well but they've been

around for more than half a century now um we'll continue that later though i hope we get back to him

from me and these two university mates of mine and so we think what better opportunity to to chat to

one of the greatest leaders of our time so we walk over and we just line up and he he walks over to

us and the first mate of mine says um mr mandela what an honor it is to meet you you've been uh

you've been an idol of mine my entire life um and and if i can be half the the person you are it'll

it'll be a it'll be a a dream come true i think that's a pretty good thing to say that's that's

well said moose and the next guy and he says um mr mandela um uh your your work with human rights is

is inspiring um what you've done for the planet is is is incredible um i just want to say thank you

and and then you had that split second moment of like okay all the good stuff's been taken

what do you what do you say to nelson mandela and the logical

person would say something similar just say thank you what a what a great what are you have a great

day you know what an honor to meet you or just say nothing at all just say you know lovely mate

you don't have to entertain but but i i in my mind i think be different be creative be like

step outside of the box make mandela laugh like give give give nelson mandela a moment he doesn't

expect and so it gets to me the third in the line and i say oh and i couldn't pull these words back

at back in after they've been said i said um mr mandela it's an honor to meet you um

i know you've always been a massive believer in education and

and you know what you've done for education is incredible but

just just to contradict that ice just skipped a lecture and look how well it worked out for me

and he he just looked at me he gave me this sort of look of pity

he shook my hand and did not even say a word and walked off and and my two mates just looked at me

and said what was that i i i don't know i don't know what that was and i couldn't i couldn't take

it back and that was my only i i had met nelson mandela he's never said he never said a word to

me but we did shake hands and that was that was as far as it got and someone who was imprisoned

on robin island uh chris for 36 years or more i think off the top of my head he broke rocks

like he's been through the hardest of all times and i tried to draw some awful analogy between

education and and me skipping a lecture and and i've always hated myself so much for that and

that's where that is where trying to step outside of the box can sometimes um sometimes get you in

trouble um you don't need to to always be different you don't always need to

to surprise but that is that is me to a t it's a world-class clanger uh chris i love uh i love

that story it's brilliant final question i appreciate how generous you've been with your

time today in a in a incredibly busy life and schedule if you could collaborate with anyone

on anything chris you've got a diverse range of interests is there anyone that springs to mind

in the spirit of collaboration um look the the person who i've always wanted to meet um

um

is uh is is probably david attenborough i've never i've never met him um but but someone who who's

um you know i hate to think what i'd say to him given that example of mandela like that

that would be an awful an awful thing to um to put on him but um just someone who i i respect

a lot and and has always sort of just carried themselves with such grace um and and in such

a beautifully measured beautifully measured way and and such a beautiful way and and such a beautiful

great spokesperson for the the animal kingdom um i would i would probably uh i would probably say

he'd be um he'd be right up there as someone who i'd love to to collaborate with to to meet and

and to understand and and get some of those some of those learnings um uh i think would be would

be pretty would be pretty amazing um yeah you know and just to i mean just to talk also talk about the

the variety of safari suits that he sported sported throughout his you know very impractical

safari suits he sported in in some very remote locations uh how he kept them crease free during

that those those various sort of adventures into the galapagos islands um he always sort of freshly

pressed safari suit which i you know you've got to you've got to respect but no i i think that um

there's so much knowledge in in in attenborough and and he leaves such a legacy that uh you've

got to

you've got to respect you've got to respect that um yeah i think he'd be right up there

that'd be a a conversation and a collaboration that i'd uh i'd love to be a fly on the wall for

and in in lots of ways because i think the baton uh handed over to you you you know were an

incredible representative of the animal world in your own creative and brilliant way and uh

really always as i said uh your energy comes through and everything you do it's a great

pleasure to spend some time with you thanks for taking the time thanks for being part of

of the animal world

the leader world and uh and sharing some of your wisdom today we really appreciate it

no worries to ask it it's it's a pleasure mate it's it's it's not often you get a chance i guess

to just to pause and and think about this sort of stuff you tend to go through your day just doing

it um but to actually stop and and think about the process and understand what goes into those

decisions is is it's a nice it's a nice point of reflection and and um and you do it well darce

it's always you've always been someone who i i've enjoyed um having a chat with um because you you

make you make a lot of money and you make a lot of money and you make a lot of money and you make a lot of money

people think and you make people think in a different way and and um and for that i'm always

i'm always grateful and i didn't even get some free advice on dennis the blue staffy which was

uh you know i'll save that for another time i i can't help but feel it's not too far away

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