Coach Kara Lawson, welcome to the Courtside Club.
And the 2025 Atlantic Coast Conference champions, the Duke Blue Devils.
What did that mean for you, firstly? Have you been able to kind of sit in that moment?
I have. And one of my goals when I took this job five years ago
was to grow this program to be one of the top programs in the country.
So that turnaround is not lost on me. It's really hard to do.
It seems like you're a tough coach, but it seems like you're a tough coach
who cares so much about these girls.
I always know that I have to start with the truth,
whether it's what they want to hear or what they don't want to hear.
We all wait in life for things to get easier. It will never get easier.
What happens is you handle hard better.
I don't know what clicked or how I finally realized it.
I was like, if you spend your life waiting for easy, you're going to always be disappointed.
Coach Kara Lawson, welcome to the Courtside Club.
I'm so excited for this. And before we jump into talking about all things Duke,
I have to show you a photo, okay?
So that is me in middle school. And those are my parents.
I'm from Ohio, but I was a huge Tennessee fan growing up.
And so this is one of your games. I forget which one exactly, but we were there.
My parents drove me down to Knoxville, Tennessee.
So as this being me, you know, a middle schooler and now sitting across from you,
being able to chat with you, this means so much.
So thank you for coming on the show.
I mean, I still meet, to this day, so many people, you know,
it's pretty amazing the reach that Coach Summit had, you know,
you know, obviously her not being with us anymore,
but just decade after it and just down the line through
different generations, I still meet people every day.
They're like, I love Tennessee. I used to watch you play.
And it's really cool to, you know, have played for such a, such a legend.
Yeah. I mean, you guys inspired me so much.
I'm the first of my family to ever play college sports.
And that was always my dream. You know, that was the pinnacle.
There were pretty much two schools that were there and you being on that team.
So I just wanted to, I want to get into the Duke stuff,
but I just wanted to let you know that because the impact is great and you're
right. It continues to run throughout the decades.
So you are in your fifth season at Duke heading into the tournament.
What's the vision.
Tell me about this team.
How far can you guys go?
I love this team. They've had an amazing growth trajectory.
It's a beautiful part about coaching.
And one of my favorite parts about just the job is that
you get a group to start the year and there's new pieces and new parts,
and you have to figure out how to blend them all together.
And they have to figure out how to blend themselves together.
And hopefully you can get to a point where you're peaking at the right time.
And certainly that happened for us in the ACC tournament to be able to win the
title. And now, you know, we're hopeful it happens again in the NCAA tournament.
I think we've proven to be a team that can beat anybody on any given night.
If, if we play, you know, up to our, up to our level that we're capable of.
But March has the other side of the coin too.
And I don't think you can run from it or be scared of it.
Like if we don't play well, we can lose to anybody on any given night.
And that's the beautiful thing about this sport and about this month is that
anything can happen.
Sometimes it makes you a little nervous and a little anxious, but that's the,
just the adrenaline and the competitiveness and the love that, you know,
I have for the sport and to be in it. So I'm,
I'm so excited to lead our group you know, in the first round on Friday.
You must love it because you continue to come back.
You've now done this tournament in so many different ways, you know, as a player,
in yourself, and then also with this team,
let's talk about that ACC championship. Congratulations. Firstly,
that's the first time in 12 years, I believe.
So you guys were cutting down the net. You were lifted up by your team.
We had the carrot era chance.
We had the water bottle shower in the locker room.
What did that mean for you? Firstly,
have you been able to kind of sit in that moment and really, you know,
And one of my goals when I took this job five years ago,
I was like, I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this.
I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this. I'm going to do this.
And one of my goals five years ago was obviously to grow this program,
to be one of the top programs in the country. When I took the job,
we were the last, we're the worst team in the ACC,
the last best team in the ACC. And, you know, obviously in the ACC tournament,
a couple of weeks ago, we're the best team in the ACC.
So that turnaround is not lost on me.
It's really hard to do because it's one of the premier women's basketball
conferences in the country. But to answer your question about
have I had a moment to like reflect, like, yes.
And I hear people get asked this question all the time. And they're just like,
no, not yet at the end of the year.
And I made a promise to myself when I took this job that I was going to enjoy
the rise and I was going to enjoy every part of it.
And I was going to reflect in the moment as best as I could without
deterring from what's in the future. And so when the tournament ended,
we took three days off and everyone,
everyone got away, right? Physically, mentally, emotionally.
I think it's really important to recharge. And on the fourth day,
when we came back, we didn't practice, but we came back together and
we reflected together about the moment.
So we sat in the room and we went around the room and we talked about what that
moment meant to us individually, each player and each coach. And
what, what were we going to, being removed from it at that time,
removed from it, but we're going to every day,
we're going to be more and more removed from it. A week removed from it,
two weeks removed from it, a month removed from it, a year removed from it,
you know, 20 years removed from it.
What is going to stand out in our brain about that moment.
And for everyone, it's something different, you know, a memory, a snapshot,
you know, of something, a facial, a glance that you shared with someone,
you know, at a specific time or a huddle or a moment in the game.
Super cool. Just to hear what everybody had.
And it was emotional, like good, like good emotional, right?
Like there were tears and, and, and to share that within our group internally.
And I won't share any of the memories because that's like,
that was an internal thing, you know, that we, that we shared together.
So, yeah, we did reflect and I love that.
It's okay to be happy about an accomplishment and it's okay to talk about it and
reflect in the moment on it. Like, what else are we here on earth to do? Like,
when good things happen to us, we should celebrate, you know,
in the moment with the people that we love. I love these players.
I love them so much. And it was great to have that together.
And then eventually, yeah, we, we,
we do move on because we have another tournament to play.
But that was a really cool, a really cool hour that we spent together.
Well, I think it's hard people in your position and in your team,
because you are coaching the best of the best.
Like these are the best players.
They're the best in the country that you're surrounded by and to get to that
you have to be relentless in your work ethic and all that they've done to get
there. So sometimes you do get wrapped up and like, okay,
we got to keep grinding. We got to get to what's next.
But I love that you guys took that moment. I think it also, I mean,
you correct me if I'm wrong, just like build a chemistry with you guys.
And I noticed that when I watched Duke women's basketball,
you guys play as a team. There is,
there's not certain players going out there that you have to rely on to put on
this many points. Like you guys are a well-oiled machine.
You play on a string on both ends of the court.
Is that something both on and off the court you've worked on to get it to where
it does play out on the court with this chemistry?
So to me, it starts in recruiting. We recruit that. Okay. You know,
like I don't think you can take a young person at 18
and just change them all the way. Right?
there are like these little things foundationally already inside of all of us
as we're growing up that our parents teach us foundationally,
that our siblings teach us that our teachers and our coaches,
like our youth coaches and our high school coaches,
like think of your athletic journey and like who impacted you and different
things that they all put inside of you.
So when I'm recruiting players and I'm talking with high school players I can't
say it's like one thing. I don't, I don't even know if I can explain it to you.
But I'm looking for like connection and
kind of, is there a similarity in how we see the game? Like how,
how we see the game and not how we see the game scheme wise, you know,
like how we see the game, like with plays and X's and O's, it's like how,
how we feel like the game should be played and how we feel like it should be
experienced. And to me, the game is built to be experienced together.
You know, there's,
there's some things in life that were built to be experienced singularly.
And then there's some things in life that were meant to be like a together
And I've always felt like basketball and team sport was meant to be experienced
together and finding players that really
love that part of the game.
And I have a group of young women that they love being together
and they genuinely enjoy the success of each other.
And that's hard to find just in life in general. I mean,
think of your relationships and your friendships and just your work,
even just like work relationships, not like a romantic relationship,
like a work relationship. Okay.
How many people are like genuinely happy when something good happens to you?
Not as many as you think, like there's a lot of jealousy, a lot of, you know,
there's a lot of like, Oh, I wish that were me or I wish that was, you know?
And so when you can get in an environment where that is the case and people are
like, man, I'm so happy for you.
I'm so happy for you, Rachel. Like that's amazing.
Like what you were able to do, even though maybe that meant I didn't do that,
That's such an amazing thing. And it's such a great environment to be in.
And so our players create that because they're the ones that it's not like I
brainwashed them or tell them to be that way. Like that's how they genuinely are.
And it's, it's awesome to see, like they, they are so happy.
Like when Aluchi got named MVP of the tournament,
like they were so excited.
You know, they weren't like, I wish I was the MVP, you know, like they,
they were so excited for her because she deserved it. You know,
I saw them on their cell phones on social media, like shouting her out,
like you're my MVP and they're all going around and like giving flowers,
but that's something that's a testament to you and the program.
But that's also something, if you don't have that,
that can destroy a good team that has a good roster of players.
If they're not able to come together in that way.
Connection is so valuable. Connection is so valuable.
your desire as an individual to impact other people and to help make other
people great is, um, is such a superpower.
And it's, it's a superpower that exists inside of all of us.
Like we all have the ability to impact people in a positive way. Um,
and so we could choose to do that in our daily interactions,
or we can choose not to, um, and choosing to do that can, man,
It can change people's day.
Like think about if you're walking down the street or,
and someone compliments you, you know, or someone's like, I really like, Hey,
I like your hair today, coach. Like I like your curls today, coach.
Like they, they, they look great.
It makes you feel good. Doesn't it?
Like a simple compliment or a simple way to impact people. And, and, um,
when you can find people that do that, like,
so I try to be a person like that.
I want my players to be people like that. And you, you can,
you can be so successful in life and not successful in like, uh,
achieve a lot, just successful with how you make people feel. Um,
you can, you can make people feel great. And, uh, I have a lot of players.
they make me feel great every day when I get a chance to see them and spend
It seems like you guys are having a good time from the outside looking in.
And that's even something after the ACC championship game, you said,
myself as a coach, I don't want to be known as a complainer.
And I am also going to be so,
so honest with my players.
Like we're going to go over the things that we did wrong.
And it seems like you're a tough coach,
but it seems like you're a tough coach who cares so much about these girls on
the court and off the court.
How do you develop that relationship with them to where you can be really
but they know that you're being tough is coming from like a good place.
You know, it's not you just being tough. Cause you just, okay,
I want to win. I need a championship. I need this.
How do you build that with the girls?
Well, I think, I think it starts with, with,
with the trust and with the honesty.
The one thing I know about basketball players,
cause I was one for a long time was that we
can spot fakes from a mile away in terms of people that aren't being real and
true with us. People that tell us what we want to hear,
people that try to get close to us for different reasons.
Like we can sense that immediately. And so my players,
I know have that sense too.
That's like a sixth sense of a basketball player.
You just have it always.
So I always know that I have to start with like the truth
and always tell them the truth,
whether it's what they want to hear or what they don't want to hear.
And so I feel like to a player,
they know that I'm not going to lie to them.
I'm not going to try to gas them up. If it's not warranted,
I'm not going to try to cut them down. If it's not warranted,
like I'm going to like stay in the real with them. That's important.
And so if you establish that,
over time and in all the situations that come up on and off the court,
good and bad, you're constantly staying in that real with them.
Then respect starts to form. I think amongst, amongst the two people,
like, okay, like even when it's good, even when it's bad, she's,
she's staying in the real. And then I challenge them.
I want them to do that with me as well,
because their real is just as important as my real.
What do I mean by that?
If I'm seeing something and,
it's my job as a coach to point out, Hey,
you're doing this the wrong way and show them. And here's why.
Then if I'm doing something the wrong way in coaching them,
my expectation is they're going to share that with me too. Right.
Have you had a player come to you with something?
Yeah. It's not like,
and right and wrong is probably the wrong words to use to describe it.
It's like inspiring and motivating people.
Everyone's different.
So the best way to inspire and motivate you is going to be different than
maybe another player.
And so if I'm using one method to get you that I think is the best method for
you, but it's not working for you, like, let's talk about it.
You know, like, how can I get you Rachel to perform at your best?
What do you need from me? Like as your coach, what do you need from me?
Tell me, like, tell me, like, like, don't,
don't send me on a scavenger hunt.
And it's taken me two months to figure it out.
And then in those two months, you and I are like banging heads.
And then you're complaining, you know,
to maybe a teammate or your parents or whatever saying like, well,
coach just doesn't get me. Well, come talk to me. So I get you.
Yeah. You know, like come sit down with me. Like I want to get you like,
come like, let's figure it out. Let's get each other.
Cause the faster we get each other, the more we get to like so many,
so many amazing places. One, the deeper our relationship gets. Right.
Like we can get to different places because we have that trust and we get one
another and we understand.
And now I don't take a criticism personally because I get what you're saying
or like, I know that that's your personality. I know.
So I think there's so many times in life, like we just got to talk.
No, we got to sit down and we got to talk to one another and we got to say,
Hey, Hey, this kind of hurt my feelings when you did this,
or this frustrated me when you did that.
And that doesn't mean I'm always going to agree with their assertions.
Right. Um, but we're going to talk about it. And now,
now we have a relationship. Now we have a relationship.
We only have a relationship if we talk about things that,
and we only have a true relationship if we have good and bad times,
you know, like a real friendship, a real relationship is not just good all the
time. You know, like I always say this, like you're either lying or you just
haven't fought yet. If you have a friendship that never had,
you know what I mean? Like we're all going to have ups and downs.
So, um, let's be strong and let's, let's talk about it.
And every player I'm on a different part of the spectrum in our relationship.
Right. Some of them are freshmen and like, we're, we're building it.
Um, some of them are seniors and man, we've, we've, we've done this.
I'm so proud, like of the different relationships.
That I have with the players and I'll pick one player in particular,
even though you didn't ask like, um, Reagan Richardson.
I love Reagan Richardson and Reagan. I have been through it.
You know, like we have been through it.
Like I did not understand her at all when she first got here and she did not
understand me at all when she first got here, but I'm so proud of us, man.
I love us. I'm so proud of us because Reagan and I have worked like we have
Together, cried together, sat outside of Cameron, you know, crying together,
been in my office, that talked on the phone.
Like we have done the real work that it takes.
And so we're so strong, man.
Like we can't, we can't be broken, you know, like we can't be broken.
And I'm so much better of a coach having, having had her as a player.
I would hope I'm not going to speak for her, but I would hope she'd say, man,
I'm so much better of a player because I've had coaches, my coach, and that's
what this thing is about.
And I'm just proud of us that we stayed in it.
And there were times, you know, that was hard to, and there were times we were
frustrated with one another, but, you know, I love her and, you know, I know
we're going to be, you know, connected for, for the rest of our lives.
I mean, that means so much because as a basketball player and myself as well,
like playing my, my whole life, you sometimes spend more time like with your
coaches and with your team than anyone.
And even I'll tell you a quick story that what was a turning point for me when
you talk about coaches.
Finding the right button, my freshman year of high school, they were so hard on
I was leaving practice crying every day.
And I finally, I was like, I don't know, but, but I'm starting, I'm a, I'm a
great player, but I'm crying because I'm like, they are so mean to me.
I'm getting picked on.
I felt like I was getting picked on and I had a meeting with them and I was like,
this is just too much.
And my coach, this is what she decided to say.
She said, Rachel, you can get thick skin.
You can get tougher or we can put you on JV.
Let us know what you want to do.
And that to me, because she knew how competitive I was, that was a turning
And I, for the rest of my life, that comes to mind for me to be tough because
life is always going to be hard.
And I know this is something that you harp on as well.
That has helped me through my basketball career, through friendships, through
my business career.
And like, that was them finding whatever that button was.
And I toughened up real quick right after that day.
Um, yesterday I was having a day.
I don't have a day where it's just hard to get up.
It's not even, you know, hard to go to practice, hard to go to your work.
I was having one of those.
And then I start prepping for this interview.
I know I'm chatting with you and your viral video where you talk about the hard, right?
So I want to read a quote from you, any meaningful pursuit in life.
If you want to be successful at it, it goes to the people who handle hard.
Well, share a little bit of that with our courtside audience.
I feel like that's obviously you've touched a lot of people in the basketball space, but
even across the world.
I think just through the different experiences that I've had in my life, um, you know, I spent
a lot of time in my life, um, waiting for the easy to come and thinking that, oh, I
just get through this, you know, it'll get easier.
If I just get through this test, you know, then the math math will get easier.
I just get the spring of my senior year, you know, like I won't have to work as hard in
And you know, if I just get it.
Shape, then the conditioning will be easier, you know, in basketball.
And so I just found myself in this space a lot and I don't know what clicked or how I
finally realized it.
I was like, if you spend your life waiting for easy, like you're going to always be
disappointed, um, because most of the meaningful pursuits or most of the big time
accomplishments go to the people that figure out how to, how to handle hard, better and
better than others.
And that just meant.
The mental shift for me was everything.
Um, so instead of waiting for the easy, it's like, okay, how can I figure this out?
How can I figure out how to handle this better than I am right now?
And so it became more like a game to me, you know, in terms of problem solving and then
what was me, this is so hard.
I'm, you know, kind of wilting under, you know, the, the pressure of the, of the difficulty
And, uh, that mental shift changed for me and I shared that with our team, uh, you know,
a couple of years ago.
And yes, definitely.
I had no idea it would resonate the way that it has.
And I still get letters and emails and people that stopped me.
I mean, still to this day, if I'm walking through an airport and people stop and we'll
say about Duke or say about Tennessee or say about whatever, right.
But now it's overwhelming, majority majority about handle hard, better.
And the coolest part about that for me is when people stop to talk to me about handle
And they share their story.
You know, like if someone stops me to talk to me about basketball, they're like, Oh coach,
I love your team.
You know, can I get a picture or, you know, I, I saw you play here, you know, it's, it's
like that kind of interaction, which are great.
I'm not saying those interactions aren't awesome.
Like I love, I love, you know, obviously when people recognize something that I've achieved,
but for handle hard, better people will come up to me and they'll say, coach, thank you
I lost my mom a year ago.
I love the video.
You know, my kid got, got diagnosed with, you know, this, this disease and they're sharing
their, they're sharing literally.
Some like pivotal life moment and how my words have helped them through that.
That's so powerful.
And they don't even usually ask for a picture, which is fine.
Because it's, it's, it's a human moment that I'm getting to have with so many people over
these last three years, I've had so many incredible, just human moments where people come up to
me and they're sharing like the hard time that those words maybe helped alleviate a little bit
it didn't take away the hard time but um how cool is that like how lucky am i like to i mean think
about every day if you woke up and like you went somewhere and at some point your day someone was
going to share a human moment with you right it's incredible um so it's really how much closer we
would all be yeah how much maybe kinder the whole world would be if we all kind of understood like
we are all going through this we're all going through something at some point so oh you have
made an impact on so many levels from the beginning of your playing career to now someone else who
also did that is pat summit she left behind such an incredible legacy that we still talk about
today what do you hope to do in your coaching career and what legacy do you hope to leave
i mean i think pat's legacy is is the greatest legacy in women's basketball history
you know um i don't know that it'll ever be surpassed nor is that a desire of mine to
to surpass her legacy i mean it's an amazing one i'm so lucky to have been able to play for her
and learn from her and i've wanted to be a coach since i was seven years old i knew i wanted to be
a coach i didn't know what level or anything like that but i knew i wanted to coach so that was
something i knew and i felt like was my purpose very early on okay in my life but how i wanted
to do it and what i was inspired to do and what i was inspired to do and what i was inspired to do
was to inspire who i was inspired by like all that happened at tennessee you know i saw this
incredibly uh strong independent charismatic tough woman and i was coached by that daily
and she worked to build a relationship with me to spend time with me she worked to challenge me
she worked to push me hard um there were
were tears. There were conversations, like all this stuff I was talking about, like with Reagan
earlier in our talk, like that was me, right? As a college player. And when you get poured into
by another person like that, one, it fundamentally changes your life. Coach Summit straight up
changed my life. But it inspired me to try to be someone that could do that for other people.
So I always knew I wanted to be a coach, but what kind of coach I wanted to be,
that crystallized for me at Tennessee playing for her. And so I know I won't be her,
you know, like I said, her legacy's unmatched. To one of one. Yes, of course. But to be able to have
relationships individually with each of my players the way she had with hers, that's my goal.
That's my goal. And so I'm going to work tirelessly. I'm going to put in the time. I'm
going to try to be the best coach that I can be for each of my players and earn their trust and
earn their belief and earn their love and try to maximize what they can do in life.
Love that. So I want to, I want to touch on it really quick.
Before I let you go, when you get back to focusing on your team, you had a busy summer
coaching Team USA. What was that like being surrounded by the great players and great
coaches that you were with? And also having Diana Taurasi there, having her just step,
stepping away from the game, but someone that you played against.
Anytime I get a chance to be involved with USA basketball, it's, it's, it's a dream.
It's amazing. It's the top of the top. It's the best coaches,
best players. You know, I got a chance to experience that as a player in Beijing in 2008.
And so kind of a full circle moment for me now to be a part of the coaching staff as an assistant
coach in Paris. So many of the players, you know, that I've watched grow, coached a lot of them at
younger levels. I never thought I'd be a coach on an Olympic team coaching a player I played against,
but I think that speaks to the, you know, the greatness of, of Diana.
And the longevity of Diana and the type of career that she was able to put together.
So that was fun. You know, it wasn't weird. It was fun. It was fun to, you know, she was my teammate
in 2008. Obviously we played against each other a ton in college and the pros, and then to have a
chance to coach her and, you know, up close as a coach, I'd seen it up close as a teammate and as
a competitor. But to witness up close, how great of a player that she is,
Awesome. And then the new generation, you know, to be around them. I mean,
Jackie and Kelsey, I coached three-on-three in Tokyo. And so to be together five-on-five was
awesome. Sabrina, I coached in three-on-three when she was in college and, you know, have a great
relationship with her. And so all the different moments of the different players was great to be
around and just inspiring and motivating too. You know, when you're around the top people
man, it motivates you to get there and to stay there. And, you know, luckily, I shouldn't say
luckily, we earned the gold medal, but it was a tough game. And France is legit. And it was an
overall just amazing experience. I mean, the trajectory of women's basketball, it's on the
rise. It will continue to go this next generation of players. And you're at the front of that. So
Kara, thank you so much again for coming on Courtside Club. I've been a fan. You've been an
inspiration to me. You've been an inspiration to me. You've been an inspiration to me. You've been
an inspiration to me. I'm so excited to watch this Duke team in the tournament. I'm rooting for
you guys. And we'll be following along the rest of the way. And you got to get to a football game
too. You know, I do the in-stadium hosting for football. I came to the Carolina game last year,
the football game, the home game. So you must have been in a suite or something or else we
would have, we would have taken you down. No, I should like, I was right by, I was right with
the players. I was right close. I like to, I like to be up close. Okay. So what? All right. Well,
next time I'm heading off.
Because we normally do a little women's basketball thing. So hopefully I see you
then if not sooner, but I appreciate your time. Thank you so much. All right. Thanks, Rachel.