For me, alcohol just sucked the life out of me and just sucked all that energy, which
is so important to my enjoyment.
When you don't drink, it makes those events a lot less interesting, and probably the people
there are a lot less interesting, to be totally honest.
I've actually got pretty much no interest in where you've worked previously.
I have no interest in a university degree.
I'm really there to focus on how do you react when I push you, and I'm going to push you
the whole time in multiple different directions.
Hi, I'm Sally Patton, editor of BOSS from the Australian Financial Review, and welcome
to 2024's Seasoned Finale of 15 Minutes with the BOSS, a podcast about success and failure
and everything in between.
And along the way, we're aiming to get some great advice from our leaders.
My guest today is Tim Gerner, the founder of Gerner Group.
Hi, Tim, lovely to see you, and thank you so much for being on our last episode for
Great to see you, Sally.
Now, Tim, as I said, you're the founder of Gerner Group, a luxury lifestyle brand focused
on real estate and wellness.
You currently have a pipeline of real estate projects across Melbourne, wider Victoria,
Sydney, the Gold Coast, Adelaide, Brisbane, and Port Douglas.
You have also set up a private anti-aging clinic, the exclusive Scent Haven, and you
are an AFR rich lister, which we love, and we calculate you have a fortune of $990 million,
and you do quite a lot to make sure you're on top of your game.
No, it's not tiring.
It's actually my passion and my obsession, so I feel very lucky to be able to do it.
We have only got 15 minutes.
The clock starts now.
Let's get started.
My first question, and I'm almost afraid to ask this, is what does your morning routine
What time do you get up?
So I'm up between quarter past five and 5.30, depending on if I'm slightly late for my 9
PM bedtime, which I've got older kids now, not older, but 12 is starting to challenge
Straight away, I go downstairs, get my lemon water and Celtic salt is the first thing I
Then I grab my coffee.
I actually do a, interesting Sally, I do a gratitude journal every morning, and it's
something that I started about four years ago.
It's really three things I'm grateful for in the day, which on the positive days is
not that effective, but on the days you're not feeling so great is actually really, really
important thing for me to do.
And then I also plan the day.
So what are the three things I want to achieve?
How do I want to come across in the day?
How do I want to lead the teams in the day?
And then I write a little journal.
It takes me about 10 to 15 minutes.
Straight after that, I'm straight up into the gym.
So I spend about 15 minutes doing stretching, mobility work.
Then I do about 45 minutes of strength training.
I do strength Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Saturday, and I do cardio Tuesday, Thursdays.
And then I have what I call surrender Sunday on a Sunday, whichever one should be doing,
which is my very, very chilled, very focused on recovery and anti-aging things on a Sunday.
After the training, I go straight into what is my setup in the gym, which has got a PMF
bed, which is a pulsed electric magnetic fuel bed with a red light therapy that comes over
the top of my body and a red light on my face.
We do that for about 20 minutes while I'm doing breath work, which is trying to reset
Wow, sounds busy.
Do you have time to actually get together with the family before going to work?
I've got three little girls, 12, about to be 11 next week and seven months.
So we actually get together for our family huddle at seven o'clock.
We all sit on the ground around our little baby and we go around the day of what is happening
So just that time to stop together for 10 minutes is really, really important.
Then sort of seven to seven forty five is getting ready for the kids to get out the
door to school and then my day starts.
So typically in the morning, if I can, I'll try to fit in about 30 minutes before the
kids get up on emails if it's possible, trying to set my day clear, whatever's happened
Then eight o'clock, we're into the day and straight into it.
And then throughout the day, I've got very set rituals around 1030, I have a protein
I'm very specific on my calories every day, I have 2900 calories a day with a very specific
macro split, have lunch at one o'clock, three thirties, a bit of breath work and downtime.
Pretty regimented and I'd say quite boring for most people because I do the same thing
So with the Gratitude Journal, why did you start doing it and what difference has it
I started actually in 2020, Covid hit.
We had three buildings coming to completion, we had a lot under construction.
It was an incredibly stressful time for us.
I thought I was going to lose everything, to be totally honest.
And I was working with Naam Baldwin, who's an incredible performance coach, who's part
And he said, look, you're just not, you're only focused on the negative, right?
We need to get you back thinking that the world could continue.
That's when I really started doing it religiously every single day.
And some days I've got to be on a celly, I wake up, I'm like, oh, I don't have time
I've got to get going.
Then I sit down for the five minutes and do it.
And it completely resets me and refocuses on what's important, right?
Rather than scatterbrain thinking about a thousand different things, I have to stop.
And some mornings they're really simple.
It might be that I'm really grateful that I get to drink this beautiful coffee or other
days it might be my amazing wife or it could be the beautiful daughter that we've just
So it's not always big prolific things.
It's actually the simple things that just train your brain to think about the positive
aspects as opposed to the chaos of everyday life.
Yeah, that's really interesting.
It's a really good way to think about what's coming up next in a positive rather than a
negative way and to really think about what you're going to do during the day.
I might have to actually adopt that.
OK, Tim, my next question is about a pivotal moment in your career.
Can you tell me about a time or a project that you worked on that changed the trajectory
of what you were doing?
Yeah, I've been very fortunate.
I've had a couple of incredibly important people in my life.
One of those was Maurice Schwartz, who is a big, you know, media, but also developer
over the times. And he instilled in me this incredible confidence to be able to take on
the world. And definitely for me, his drive, his positivity, his entrepreneurship
and the way he thinks outside the square is the reason I am where I am today.
And how did you meet him?
Did you take him on formally as a mentor or informally?
How did that work?
No, so it's actually interesting.
It was back in 2007 and it was typically when developers were advertising apartments from
$299 plus. It was trying to get the cheapest, cheapest, cheapest, cheapest you could possibly
do. And then I was driving along St Kilda Road and there was this one sign up that said
apartments are worth every million.
I thought, my God, this is like completely against the market.
This guy's completely mad.
So what happened then?
I called him up and said, look, I'd love to work for you.
And he says, I don't have anyone working for me.
I don't really need you. And I said, have a coffee with me.
And I had a coffee with him the next day.
And I started about a week later and my position with Morrie was, I'll work for nothing.
I'll come in and work with you. I don't care what you pay me or not.
And then within a very short period of time, we became very, very close.
And he gave me a part of the business.
And then the rest is history from there.
So really interesting that Morrie was able to change your perception of value and
really help you to think outside the box.
OK, but let's leave that to my next question is, what is the best piece of career
advice you've ever been given?
It's actually from a hippie that I live with.
And I came home one day, I was working part time at a real estate agent while I was still
studying. And I was like, you do when you're 19.
I was complaining that my boss isn't good enough and I'm not paid enough and I'm
working too hard and all that stuff.
And she sat me down the couch.
I can still remember it like it was yesterday and said, well, what do you love to do?
And I said, well, I love training.
I love being in the gym and I don't want to have a boss.
I hate having a boss.
And she said, oh, can't you start a gym?
I'm like, oh, I don't know.
I've never thought about that before.
I don't know. Maybe I can start a gym.
I slept in at that night.
And then the next day I started looking for locations.
And within a very short period of time, I secured a location in Elwood.
I was very fortunate that I was able to open that gym.
I took a big loan to do it at the time.
And then obviously six weeks into that, my dad passed away.
And that was by far the biggest test of my life.
So I take on a hundred and fifty thousand dollar loan with NAB at the time, which I
think without telling me, I think my mom supported with their house.
We then lost three grandparents in the next two months.
So my family went through a lot of hardship over that time.
And, you know, I'd give up everything to have my dad back today.
That sounds like a really difficult time.
How did you manage to keep on moving forward?
I think for me, you know, the first week or two was just deep hurt, right?
It was very difficult for my sister and my mom and all of us and very challenging.
And then I guess over time for anyone who goes through that, you know, time does
slowly, slowly heal and, you know, think about what dad wanted me to be.
He wouldn't have wanted me to suffer.
He didn't want me to sit there.
He wanted me to get back out there and really enjoy life.
So for me, it was much about how do I prove to dad that I can do everything
that he always wanted me to do and make him proud and make my mom and sister
proud without that period of time.
I'm not sure I'd be where I am today.
My first ever business, I was, you know, waking up in the morning.
I was training at 5.30.
I was then selling mid-morning and then I was doing the books on my job, which
I'd never done before in the afternoon.
And then I was training at night.
And to do that when you're, when you're hurting so much was a really big
challenge and probably set my drive and resilience for the rest of my life.
Yeah, I can imagine that it takes a lot to work through all that stuff.
At a really difficult time, but not only that to actually use it to move
forward professionally and personally.
Thank you for sharing that.
Now, Tim, stay right where you are.
We're going to take a short break.
And when we come back, we're going to open the chatter box.
Welcome back to 15 minutes with the boss.
I'm here with Tim Gerner, the founder of Gerner group.
Now, Tim, this is our section called the chatter box.
Now, Tim, in front of me is our beautiful brown chatterbox inside,
which are about 20 questions.
I would normally ask you to have a fish in the box and pick out questions, but
because we are in different States, you are going to have to trust me to do it on
I hope you're okay to do this.
Are you ready for me to start fishing?
Yes, Sally, let's do it.
Here we'll have a forage in the box.
See, I'm just foraging around.
When was the last time you gave up doing something or had to quit doing something
because it wasn't working?
Do you know, it's not a work thing, probably alcohol.
I haven't fully given it up, but I've given it up 99%.
It's probably the best way to say it.
Maximum I'll have is a drink if I'm out nowadays.
And that was probably a big give up.
I still find the social pressure really difficult.
I still think Australians are a shocking at alcohol.
I think we are, there is a huge amount of peer pressure in communities still
today, which I think is terrible.
I don't really care what people think.
I still find it very difficult to sit around a table when everyone's drinking
and, and not drink.
And I think that's a real shame Australia is in that place.
And that's a decision I have to make probably 18 months ago.
And, you know, it comes with consequences because when you don't drink, it makes
those events a lot less interesting and probably the people there are a lot less
interesting, to be totally honest.
So been an interesting transition.
What impact has that had on the rest of your life though?
Well, I wake up feeling great.
So that's the, that's the biggest thing.
So for me, it means freeing up time means I can train better.
I can be a better parent.
I can be a better friend.
I can be a better husband and just be a better person for myself.
I get the real guilt when I wake up feeling average.
I don't like to feel average.
Hence why I'm so regimented on my sleep.
Sleep is by far the most important thing for me.
So for me, alcohol just sucked the life out of me and just sucked all that energy,
which is so important to my enjoyment.
I have heard that a bit from other CEOs.
I'm going to have a fish around.
How do you celebrate your wins, both personal and professional?
We don't do it enough is the first thing I'd say.
We are constantly trying to achieve more and we're constantly trying to grow the
business and I think it's probably one of my failings in the last six months that
it's been particularly in real estate.
It's been a very, very hard three or four years.
We've had costs go through the roof over 60%.
And so even when you have that little win, you've got one win.
If you've got 30 problems, you still have to solve.
So it is something in the business that we will, we will continue to do.
It's something in the business that we will, you know, as soon as something does
happen, we do get the team around and we do celebrate it.
We've got a WhatsApp team group that goes around the whole office and we do try and
celebrate each of the little wins.
But again, it goes, Sally, it's interesting, isn't it?
It goes back to the alcohol comment because Australians celebrate events with
And that's something that is not so easy to do.
So we do occasionally crack the bottle of champagne and celebrate that, but maybe
we need to be cracking a smoothie together as opposed to the bottle of alcohol.
So as you say, the real estate industry went through a really tough period during
COVID. How did you find that personally?
Was it really, really tough going?
Oh, it's been absolutely shocking.
If I wasn't committed to what I do for my fitness and wellness and to my family to
get out of it, I can tell you that the first six months of this year was by far the
hardest thing mentally, physically, culturally.
It's never been harder because we've had 2020 was just the chaos of 2020, right?
I don't even really remember what happened apart from I thought the whole world was
going to end. Then from 21 to 23, imagine running a business where for 20 years
you've been able to estimate your costs within 1 percent, right?
And you're usually pretty good at it.
And then the closest you get to a budget is 30 percent over budget.
We had some that were 150 percent over budget.
So in the development industry, we worked to a 20 percent margin on cost and our
costs went up between 50 and 150 percent in two years.
So people say, how's business?
Well, I'm like, well, when you're working on 20 percent margin, your costs are up 60
percent. It's a pretty challenging time.
So, you know, going through those hard times, people stuck with us.
But it was it was extremely difficult.
You know, you're having no wins.
You're working as hard, but no wins.
If you didn't have that wellness side, if you weren't fit and well rested and
strong, like, how would you have coped with that?
It would have been really, really difficult.
I don't think it would have been possible, to be honest.
I think I would have had a nervous breakdown.
Goodness, that must have been a really tough period.
And thank goodness you really did look after yourself.
OK, Tim, we are going to have one more question.
I am going to have a fish around in the box on your behalf.
What are your favourite interview questions when you hire somebody and why do you ask
what you ask? I am a very different interviewer, Sally.
I let people talk, but I ask them a thousand questions at completely random times,
halfway through the sentence, all over the place the whole time.
And the reason I do that is, firstly, I'm interested in a direction they're going.
But secondly, I want to see how they react when things change.
So I don't have any set process.
I don't ask you about your history.
I've actually got pretty much no interest in where you've worked previously.
I have no interest in a university degree.
I'm really there to focus on what's your drive like, what's your motivation.
How do you react when I push you?
And I'm going to push you the whole time in multiple different directions,
particularly senior executives.
Like I will go extremely hard, not in a not in an aggressive way,
but just a very demanding, constant questions to see how they react,
because that is the job of an executive in a senior role with us.
You have to be malleable. You've got to be able to move.
You've got to be able to think on your feet.
So it's more about not the specific question,
more about fire gun and not letting anyone get into a realm of in 2004.
I worked for CBA and then I moved in 2006 to ANZ.
I have zero interest in that kind of interview process.
I want to very quickly work out how they think on their feet.
So what sorts of reactions are you looking for?
Like you might be asking something about how they developed a building
or something, and then you ask them if it's completely separate
and completely unrelated. Yep.
So it's all about body language.
It's all about physical eye contact.
How do they look at me? How do I look at the other person in the interview?
Typically, there'll be someone else in the interview.
Do they get flustered by it?
Are they nervous to the point where it would be unproductive
if they were in front of a capital partner?
Oh, so it's not just about their achievements.
It's about how they show up in an interview
and therefore how they would show up in front of clients.
And it's all about their demeanour as well. I love that.
There is one more question for you, though, which we ask all our guests.
And that is if we were the holiday gods and for some reason
could give you 12 months off and promise that you would come back
to your own company, what would you do?
Well, one thing I know, I would be just with my wife and my three girls.
That is for sure. We would be travelling, definitely.
We'd be somewhere warm. I do not like the cold.
Hence, living in Melbourne has its challenges.
We would be probably, whether it's through Asia,
Maldives, through Europe, we'd be on the beach.
We'd be very slow.
We'd be walking the cobblestone laneways through Europe
and very quiet, holding hands, just taking it all in.
But it would be a very, very quiet year.
It would be just us and there'd be no one else there.
And it'd be a beautiful thing if you can arrange that for me.
And can you see yourself stepping outside of your health
routine in order to do that?
Or do you think you would transport it all with you?
No, that it'll all be with me 100 percent. That's my life.
And that's that's what my family, I'm very lucky.
My middle daughter, who's just about to turn 11 next week,
she trains with me almost every morning.
She walks with me twice a day.
She's a big part of my wellness regime.
My 12 year old would much rather be on the couch with her iPad.
But I'm very fortunate that my wife's extremely fit
really into her wellness and so are my kids.
So now that'd be a big part of our regime when we were travelling.
And that is our 15 minutes up.
Tim, I really love talking to you today.
I really appreciate the gratitude journal that you write
and the fact that you have been getting up every morning
for four years to write that.
I'm not sure if I could do your entire morning routine,
but I love hearing about it.
And I also really like the fact that you are so strict
on your eight hour sleep.
Clearly, that's really important to you.
I agree about our mindset on alcohol.
And as Australians, we probably do drink a lot more than we should
and certainly a lot more than we need to.
So thank you again for allowing us to spend 15 minutes with the boss.
Thank you, Sally.
And thank you to everyone who has tuned into this podcast in 2024.
We've had a great time bringing it to you,
and I hope you've all found one or two little gems buried in there somewhere.
We are now going on a summer break.
The podcast will return on January the 28th with Matt Common,
who's the chief executive of Commonwealth Bank of Australia.
But to keep you entertained, we are going to release extended versions
of some of our favourite podcasts as part of our summer series,
which will begin on January the 7th.
In the meantime, have a great break.
And the team from AFR podcast is very much looking forward
to doing it all over again in 2025.
If you like the podcast and you want to hear more,
consider sharing the podcast or writing a review
as it helps us to reach more people and follow us wherever you get your podcasts.
At The Financial Review, we investigate the big stories about markets,
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For more, go to AFR.com and you can subscribe to The Financial Review,
the daily habit of successful people at AFR.com slash subscribe.
This podcast was hosted by me, Sally Patton,
produced by Lapfan and Martin Peralta.
Our theme is by Alex Gao and our executive producer is Fiona Bafini.
The Australian Financial Review.